Which is better, Army, Marines, or Navy?

[andrewdane19]

hey i noticed there are alot of people in the army and marines on here and im considering enlistting in the armed forces once im 18. which is the better branch? i dont like the navy much because i think there wimps, and the marines seem the toughest so im deciding between the army and marines. so which is more hardcore? which has the better boot camp? can you guys give me some differences between the two?

[Megatron]

join the special forces instead?

[airsoft guy]

You know if my grandfather heard you call the Navy a bunch of wimps he's probably have me kick your ass, mainly because he's old and weak now.

Go with Army, the Marines pump you full of propiganda. In fact the Navy is the Marine's taxi service. MARINE=My Ass Rides In Navy Equipment.

[Menno]

Let me start of by introducing myself a little bit. I was a Corporal (E-4) in the Army. So this post's purpose is only to bring in "enlightening" information.

I don't want to offend anyone so please have "thick skin" when I say this (after all, military personnel are supposed to have thick skin).

My opinion of Army Boot shouldn't be taken for gospel, because it may have changed a lot since I graduated Basic. I went to Fort Benning; and it IS true that Fort Benning is the most difficult Basic Training post in the Army. I'm pretty sure all the posts, EXCEPT Benning and Sill, are "weaker" than Basic for the Marines. One of the reasons for this is the coed training in the other posts (I'm pretty sure Benning is still all males). I would have to say the intensity level of Benning and Sill is in par with Pendalton. But I do have to mention that you train in other things in Marine Boot than in Army Boot (ie: swimming/water survival). Ok, now thats when I went to Boot. Nowadays, the Army has gotten too P.C. (politically correct) and it sucks. I mean, what the hell is this Stress Card crap?! So basic training in a lot of places (hopefully still not at Benning) are made "easier."

But for new potential recruits (like Andrew) the bottom line is you are trained in basically the same thing in Army and Marine Boot. The thing that differs are the method of training. Both have BRM [Basic Rifle Markmenship], but a Marine friend of mine says that Army BRM is more practical - it trains more in combat firing. But if you want to argue distant accurate shooting (such as sniping, etc) than Marine BRM is stronger. Marines have the Crucible, but Army has the FTX [Field Training Excercise]. At the end, both soldier and Marine come out being able to perform basic combat skills. The question of who will perform better, I seriously have to say it's the individual. I know a lot of "ate-up" soldiers who make the Army look bad. But than, there are those types in the Marines too. At the same time, there are some Hooah soldiers and squared away Marines. The Marines do push harder on the discipline part (than standard Army infantry). The Army used to be just as hard in that area but has recently been "dropping the ball" a little bit. However, I believe that with stronger leaders at the units can change that. So for potential recruits such as Andrew, in picking which Branch to be a part of, I don't think you should based your decision by what their Boot is like. Just remember, its not how tough Boot is that determines how great of a soldier/Marine you are, its how your unit is - Boot trains basics, your unit is where you train tactics, instill values, disciplines, etc.

So what should you look at when you need to pick one of the three Branches? The answer is this: what kind of job in the military do you want? After you have determined that, picking the branch should be next. To help you with that, here are the differences between the Army and Marines (again, I'm not dissing on or promoting one branch or the other)

MARINES - They are the 911 force. This is because: 1) they have less equipment than the Army, 2) most of them are on ships which are in the coastal areas of the hostile area. The main objectives of the Marines are: 1) safeguard the ships and docks, 2) go in first and establish a foothold in the hostile state/country. Every Marine is a rifleman first. So each Marine, regardless of MOS, are expected to perform with a rifle. They are, in my opinion, the premiere amphibious force. This means they can storm the hell out of beaches. I believe that this makes a Marine Infantryman in par (in training/skill) with an Airborne Infantryman in the Army - both of them being more "specialized" than regular Army Infantry (ie: mechanized). Marines have only one group of special forces, but they do have whats called "special forces capable." They have MEU which are trained well enough to be considered special forces but they do not belong in SOCOM. Marines are the least funded, which can mean older equipment, etc. But recently they been getting some cool new stuff (ie: new camouflage). Marines do not have combat support (or have only a few). They don't even have Marine medics - they have Navy Corpsmen. Marines belong to the Department of the Navy, they do not have their own department. Thus, they are considered by some as "Sailors with rifles."

ARMY - They are the superior land force in the world. Currently, the Army is transforming. It used to be this heavy, slow powerhouse. Now, its transforming to become more of a medium, quick force. While Marines are "rifleman first," the Army is trying to make every unit (every MOS) "combatants" first; which is sort of the same idea. While Marines can storm the hell out beaches (which the Army will be weaker at), Army Infantry are trained to infiltrate from the sky. So focus on infiltration methods are different. The Army has special forces. They have the Rangers (who are the best light infantry in the world), Special Forces aka "Green Beret" (who are experts in unconventional warfare in wartime and diplomats in peacetime), and "Delta" (the elite counter-terrorism unit). The Army is also focusing more of their efforts on quickly deployable, highly trained light infantry, which is sort of like a "special forces lite". The Army has combat support and service support.

Navy: The Navy is essential to U.S. military. Without the Navy, or if the Navy wasn't performing as they do now, our Marines would be NOTHING. They provide ALL the support, funding, transport, EVERYTHING for the Marines. Remember, the Marines are the only branch that is not its own department. The Marines are NOT self-sustaining (thus providing one reason they are "expeditionary"). So don't bash the Navy.

Therefore, the Army sustains itself while the Marines need the Navy. The Army is an occupying force. The Marines go in and establishes a foothold. After that is done, the Army will usually come in and take over. Once the Army comes in, the Marines job is pretty much complete (but that doesnt mean they are no longer used). The Army, being the occupational force, will stay there longer. Plus, not only does the Army occupy, but they are also the ones that sweep acroos the hostile country and "take over."

Marines are hardcore. But the Army is not any "less hardcore." I think it's just the "friendly branch rivarly" that blinds a person from only seeing what they want to. And that is how each branch gets their personnel. As you go on up the ranks, you will see that each branch gets the best training for what their job requires.

And on the topic if "friendly rivalry," the Army is the one that focuses more on stealth. I mean moreso than the Marines. And thats because of the fact that the Army gets more funding, thus have more equipment. Combat units in the Army have a little saying: "We own the night." Thats because we work in stealth.

Marines ARE hardcore. Army IS hardcore. But, again, that is only determined by the unit. If the unit and its leadership sucks ass, then they misrepresent their branch. You will always have those units. Just stay in the squared away ones.

At the end, those three branches focuses on different things (just like all special forces - green berets, SEALs, etc - do different things), so when it comes to it, you can't really say whos better than the other - they both specialize in different things. Also, as you progress in the military, you will learn that all branches work together. This is easily seen in Afghanistan. What happened first? Army Special Forces perform reconaissance and secure/eliminate certain targets. Then came the airstrikes by the Air Force/Navy. Then the Marines came in and took over Kandahar, etc. Once establishing it, who went in? The Army (101st Airborne). So again, both branches are different.

So basically thats it. Yes there are problems in Boot camp for the Army. I'm sure there are some in Marines Boot too. When it comes to difficulty, they both have events more difficult than their counterparts. With things like discipline, I believe Marines have it more difficult, but your unit is what makes the soldier/Marine who they are. Boot camp for any branch is doable. But don't take that as me saying that they're easy. Not everyone is made to be in the Army or the Marines (nor the Navy or Air Force - but they DO have the easiest Boot!).

Just remember this, wherever you go, commit to it. Perform the best you can and you'll be the better soldier/Marine. Any soldier can out perform a Marine and vice-versa. It's about how the individual takes it, trains, and performs.

Marines do alot more braggin and talking then infantryman do, for a variety of reasons. So then the question is, what’s up with all that "elite" talk? The answer... straight from my Marine buddy’s mouth: "ego." Throughout all the Marine training, they are called the "911 force," etc etc. When they want to go from E-5 to E-6... they have to do one of these three duties: embassy guard, D.I., or recruit. Embassy guards are told they are the best and must represent America. D.I. must train the recruit to be "the best." Recruiters must attract recruits to "the best." So the ego thing is re-emphasized. And another thing about the "elite" thing: For the Marines, there is really nothing "higher" to become. They focus on becoming a Marine. That is achieved after Boot. (No, I'm not forgetting Force Recon. I'll get back to that one.) For the Army, they have a lot more things to "strive for." After becoming a grunt, they can look up to Rangers. After that, the Green Berets and then DELTA. In the "Army world," there exists the "more elite" ladder. For the Marines, the goal is to become a Marine and there’s not much more than that. Force Recon is not really strived for as often as grunts wanting to become Rangers. Why? Because Marine grunts reached their goal - to become a Marine.

At the very end, we're all U.S. Armed Forces. We need each other. Seriously, for me, I don't "Branch bash" (except for "shits and giggles" with my Marine friends). Remember we're all Americans - especially in the time of war. Each branch works with each other. Each branch has their professionals and their "scumbags."

The question is, which will YOU be?

Sorry for the very long post, but if you're serious about this I figured I'd give you a very serious answer and not BS you. Be professional. Have pride in your branch, your organization, and your unit. But overall, have pride in being an American and being in her Armed Forces - the most powerful military in the fuckin world!

[andrewdane19]

holy shit!!! lol u should be a recruiter. thanks though for the info, im probably going to enlist in the army based on the thinggs you told me. thanks for the help

[Menno]

I do wish to make a correction to my statement above, where I said the Marines always go in first. In virtually every modern conflict Army special forces have gone in first, and most of the rest of the conflicts are a coin-toss of Marines and Army Airborne units going in first. The reason why the Marines go in first a majority of the time isn't because they are more "elite", but because they're usually the quicker deployable force. Maybe Hammer or some of the other military guys on here will chime in their suggestions though.

[Thor Kaufman]

what does MOS mean by the way ? Member of service ?

[Menno]

what does MOS mean by the way ? Member of service ?

Army MOS stands for Military Occupational Specialty; in other words the field you specialize in. It's a number followed by a letter code. For example, when I was in the Army I was an 11B [Eleven Bravo], an Infantryman. A 19K [Nineteen Kilo] would be an Armor Crewman. The letter code is based upon the military alphabet.

[trythebill]

i'd go marines if you want to fight.

might want to at least check this out.

http://www.noreplacementfordisplacement ... 00956.html

and

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/vi ... php?t=4214

[Aneurysm]

If I was an american I would go for the army because of the rangers , green berets or delta , from what I have heard and see the marines training just doesnt appeal to me.

[Franz Schubert]

Nice post Menno.

[Menno]

i'd go marines if you want to fight.

Well I have to disagree a bit with that statement. The 10th Mountain Division (which I was a part of, as an infantryman of the 172nd Infantry Brigade), and the 82nd and 101st Airborne divisions see lots of combat, in many cases moreso than the Marines. Granted if you're in the 1st Infantry Division (Mechanized) where most units are stationed in Germany, you probably never will see any major combat. As is the case with the Marines, where some will see combat and some won't. So if you enlist in the Army, it has more to do with what division you'll be in regards to being involved combat-wise in America's conflcits/wars. Those Army divisions I mentioned have been involved in almost every single military conflict, and are some of the best trained soldiers (aside from Rangers and special ops) in the military, on par with the Marines.

[Nuclear Gandhi]

Yes. In "Black Hawk Down" they totally glorified the Marines as the "thing to be". As if they were the best, but they're not.

I would say Delta Force is 1226.

[Megatron]

you could join the police, you get to hit people with sticks and shit

[Spazmo]

Yes. In "Black Hawk Down" they totally glorified the Marines as the "thing to be". As if they were the best, but they're not.

I would say Delta Force is 1226.

There were no Marines in Black Hawk Down. Only Army Rangers, SOAR and Delta Force. The Marines were nowhere to be found.

[Wolfman Walt]

I'm suprised no one has mentioned the Navy SEALs. Ofcourse when you look at how fit you have to be (Both Mentally and pyshically) I can understand why. Still, the SEALs should be considered if your looking at any sort of special forces. Just be forewarned that if you're gonna try to be a SEAL look forward to spending alot more time at the gym and alot less time doing anything else.

[Menno]

Yes. In "Black Hawk Down" they totally glorified the Marines as the "thing to be". As if they were the best, but they're not.

I would say Delta Force is 1226.

There were no Marines in Black Hawk Down. Only Army Rangers, SOAR and Delta Force. The Marines were nowhere to be found.

There were also 4-5 SEALs (forgot the exact number) involved in the operation, as well as elements of the 10th Mountain Division (during the rescue attempt), and several UN units. When all hell broke loose, it was mainly the efforts of the Delta, and a lesser extent the SEALs, who kept things together on the ground. To my knowledge, there were no Marines involved in the operation; I believe they were pulled out a couple of months (or more) before the operation was launched.

[T51b]

Go with the Air Force... Like Menno I was in the army (91 Whiskey "Health Care Specialist" AKA Combat Medic) and I went to Fort Benning for basic, too (B co 2/47 inf), and it was pretty PC, even with no females there. We had to sit through like a week of power point classes on sexual harrasment and the drill sergeants weren't supposed to swear, they'd say "Dog-gone," it sounded so stupid, and from talking to people who went to Fort Jackson and Knox it sounded like our basics were exactly the same. Of course if your an 11-Bullet Catcher your stay at Fort Benning might be a bit more harsh. But if your anything but a combat-arms MOS (11-series infantry, 12-series combat engineer, 13-series field artillery, and 19-series armor) Basic is a breeze.

Anyways, the Army is cool and all, and going out on field problems is fun, but after a while you get really sick of it. Paintballing, airsoft, and video games make it seem really fun, but when its your job it gets old FAST.

I declined the option to reenlist earlier this year and instead am enlisting in the Airforce. PT isn't mandatory, theres better looking women, better locations (lets see... in the Army I went to Ft. Benning GA, Ft Campbell KY, Fort Polk LA and Ft Sam Houston TX.... Not very good places to be except for Sam Houston which I admitted rocked because its in San Antonio but the Airforce has THREE bases in San Antonio!), and just generally a lot less BS. In a line-unit, as a medic attatched to the infantry, most days I mowed lawns and picked up trash or worked odd-jobs around battalion.

As for the Army being hardcore... In the field everyone is pretty hooah hooah, and motivated and all that but when your not at a field problem the objective word is "sham" ie to do as little as humanly possible while looking really busy so your plt sgt or 1sg doesn't have you do something else like work at the motorpool or mow lawns or paint curbs or something (which you do like 3/4 of the month). If your like not in a line unit though, like if your a 71L (secretary) you'll work in an office and stuff all the time and won't have to worry about mowing lawns and crap.

The Marines, I think, are much more hardcore then the Army. I've got a friend in the Marines who said they do PT on the weekends. I never had to do PT on the weekends in the Army. They also have more stringent PT standards, they run 3 miles on PT tests instead of 2. Also like, one day I remember it was raining and lots of lightning and thunder and all that so PT for the day for us Army guys was cancelled. But there was a group of Marines on post and I remember sitting in the company area watching the lightning when I saw this group of Marines running in their little green shirts and shorts with camelbaks running in the lightning storm with an M998 driving behind them to keep pace. Crazy bastards!

[Rev]

I would like you to say that navy is weak to a Navy Seal. Their the most elite team out their. I dont know much about the military by experiance but i watch alot of suff on the history channel and out of all the specails on the military i liked the navy seal one the best. They do a bit of everything nothing is really an opstical for them they go land, sea, and air. They have the hardest training out of all the specail forces. I mean 2 weeks of praticaly no sleep, nothing but hard as hell shit they have you do. Here some of the stuff i saw, they drownd you then bring u back so you know what its like to drowned. They use to beable to beat the shit out of u but now they cant. And running, they do more running in a week than most of us will every do in our life time put together. Any wayz im board and just blabing on.

[Menno]

Well I'm going to have to disagree with you on a few points; not because you're "wrong" per se, more like every unit isn't the way you described. First I want to go over and clarify what you're absolutely right about, and then secondly a few things you're mistaken about. You're absolutely right about an Army non-combat MOS having it easier than the Marines, or easy in general. A Marine non-combat MOS definately trains harder(physically) and has more discipline than an Army non-combat MOS. And in most cases, Marines train harder than Army conventional Infantry. But this is not true for all units in the Army.

To give you an example from my personal experience, the 172nd Infantry Brigade (the Snow Hawks), located at Forts Richardson and Wainwright in Alaska, are specially trained for arctic and mountain warfare. We would routinely train in temperatures ranging from 85 degrees in the summer, to -45 and even -60 below zero during the winter, with frigid winds. The Marines have a mountain warfare school in California, but it pales in comparison to the one in Alaska. The Army maintains a mountain arctic warfare training school at Fort Greely, Alaska. Training didn't cease when the weather got bad or when the thermometer dropped. When the Marines came up to Alaska for training they froze their asses off, and weren't able to run for long, and when they did it was only under certain optimal conditions. Infantrymen at Wainwright run outside for morning PT every day (except Sunday) unless it's below -50 degrees. With Yukon stoves and extreme-cold-weather gear, we would continue field exercises where it's so cold that the mere tap of a hammer could shatter steel (trust me, I tried it). During my time there, we had (I believe) four deaths due to the cold weather training. The out-of-whack day/night cycles and brutal cold is a huge motivator though; soldiers come out of there hardened, since they're taught how to whip the environment. And if they can do that, they can whip anything. Mountain-climbing, skiing, rappelling, survival training for an extended period of time, etc. You name it and we done it on virtually a daily basis.

Recently Canadian forces, the Japanese Self-Defense force, and elements of the Russian Far East Military District have deployed to Alaska for training, as well as the other branches to participate in Northern Edge [a Joint Training Excercise Event]. 98% of Alaska is uninhabited, allowing miles upon miles of training ground. These training areas offer maneuver training over realistic distances and terrain unmatched at any other Army Navy, Air Force, or Marine installation. Additionally, the arctic conditions present during a great part of the year offer a training environment that no other training area can duplicate. In Alaska, air and ground units train in arctic conditions, over realistic distances, and at optimum speeds and tempo.

This purpose of this post isn't to brag or whatnot. The purpose of it is to show that training isn't necessarily the same in every location in the Army. Basic training is Basic training; it's doable no matter what branch you're in if you're willing. However, I'm a firm believer in that its the unit you belong to that instills the level of discipline, training, and abilities. Units in the Airborne corps, especially some units of the 10th Mountain Division, go through a great deal of strenuous training, which in my opinion is superior or on par to Marine training. Not necessarily because they're "tougher"; that's solely based upon the individual. I have seen Marine slackers in my time, so its not really only the Army that has it's share of slackers. It's mainly because of the training facilities available, and the wide spectrum of missons that those divisions encompass. So if you want to be an Infantryman in the Army, shoot for the 10th Mountain and to a lesser extent the Airborne divisions (or the Rangers, the premiere light infantry in the world; if you're able and willing to go for it). However, in terms of infantry, Marines are superior in training and discipline than conventional infantry (the Army Mechanized Infantry Divisions) in a general sense, but again it's really based upon the individual and the unit. I can't, and won't, disagree with what you saw and experienced because I wasn't there, and I'm definately taking your word for it. But for whoever is reading this and is interested in enlisting, it isn't always like that at every single Army base.

And I agree 100% of your assessment of the Air Force. I'm thinking about enlisting in the AF next year if I choose not to go back to the Army; as a Security Forces Apprentice (basically an AF MP). The major reason being there's an Air Force base (Nellis AFB) not too far from where my girlfriend lives in Vegas, and because I can jump into law-enforcement right after I get out. Plus, I get to push around AF punks, what could be better than that! Oh, and I'm saddened to hear about Benning, thanks though for being the bearer of bad news [cries].