T3:Rise of the Machines kicks ass.

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Saint_Proverbius
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Post by Saint_Proverbius »

Neon Dingo wrote:Provide a few examples of how T2 "assfucks" the series (It not being a series before T2 was released) and then we'll talk.
Oh, I don't know, how about the whole bit about John Connor can not exist if Judgement Day never happens? The whole last hour of T2 was devoted to assfucking the series - changing something that can't possibly be changed.
First of all, the T-X is just lame. Let's add a plasma cannon and a saw! That will make her really cool! Not. She didn't even really use her weapons all that effectively to justify her being any better than the T-1000 in my opinion.
Once more time, since you're obviously not smart enough to grasp this concept: PLASMA CANNON > KNIFE.
No point. I just hated the female terminator.
Terminators all have a default look based on their model number. It'd be stupid to have only male terminators since the entire point of them is as an infiltration unit. If you can't grasp that, there's no help for you.
First of all, the T-X is just a regular T-101 combined with a T-1000. Nothing creative about that. Just highly derivative. T-X is metal. T-101 is metal. So? He was a walking knife goddammit. That's fucking cool. T-1000 melded to the floor. That was awesome. T-1000 opened an elevator with his knife arms. They just expanded on those ideas for T-X basically.
No, it's a T-800.. 101 is the model number. Model 101s look like Arnie, model 102s look like someone else, model 103s look like someone different from 101 and 102, and so on.

And everything other than the floor bit, which was pretty stupid to begin with(Where's the T-1000's power source, CPU, etc?) the T-X can do because it has the same polymemetic alloy around it. It could make knives, claws, etc. but it doesn't need to because it's got that gun arm!

Furthermore, because it has an endoskeleton, the T-X can do a hell of a lot more - like have built in tools and weapons. It can be stronger because you have an endoskeleton backing up up that alloy. It can be faster since you don't have the liquid metal alloy pushing it around, the skeleton carries it.
Alright, I'd like to know who checks who's a terminator when in fact nobody knows what the hell a Terminator is except for the main characters. They made T-X a female because they wanted to try something new and wanted to give a bunch of guys (the target audience) boners. I thought she was lame as hell. She didn't have the intimidation that the T-1000 had with his scrawny angular face. She was a manequin, goddammit.
Did you even SEE the first Terminator?! Terminators were designed to infiltrate the human resistance in the future. That's their whole point! As such, you'd need models of both genders. That's why you'd have both male and female models, kid - they're infiltration units! You make two genders, and it doesn't matter which one you send back! Just pick one that's closest to the time unit, and tell it to go kill people!
...Right. But that still doesn't make them any more balanced than regular shoes.
Maybe they should all wear snowshoes then. :roll:
Yes, I am nitpicking. But I'm nitpicking this specific thing because the female terminator idea is fucking stupid.
No, you're just fucking stupid because you can't grasp why an infiltration unit would neen to come in both models.
You must have totally missed the part where the T-1000 ran a 2 ton steel beam into the side of the Terminator five times.
You must have missed where that beam was on suspended rollers.
Oh yeah, and the part where he gets the Terminator's arm ripped off.
The T-1000 didn't rip that arm off, it was ripped off in gearworks.
Oh yeah, and the part where he stabs him with a metal pole.
Kyle Reese smacked the T-800 around in Terminator with a crowbar, he must be super strong!
T-X doesn't really kick his ass. She just "corrupts his system" and he somehow overwrites this corruption with the compassion of John Connor. Please.
What compassion for John Connor? The T-800 didn't care anything about John Connor any more than the fact he was a mission parameter. This movie wasn't A Boy and His Terminator, that was T2. And the T-X most certainly did kick the T-800's ass, she stomped his damned head off.
Wrong. You see, T2 tricks you into thinking another machine is after Connor, like in the first one. But wait! Arnold Schwarzenegger is the protector! And we have a new machine that wants to kill him! T3 it's the same thing as T2. Arnold protects Connor, new advanced machine comes after him.
In both movies, you have a bad guy sent back to kill someone in the past and in both movies, a protector is sent back as well. That's the plot of all three movies. The T-800 in T2 is just playing Kyle Reese's role of the protector and the T-1000 is filling in the role of the T-800 in Terminator.
Don't recall that, but you're probably right.
The T-800 jumps on the hood of the car and punches his hand through the windshield, trying to grab Sarah, they shoot Arnie off the hood IIRC, and then they drive off. Basically the same thing as what happens in T2 and T3, except rather than shooting the terminator off in T3, they run under a tractor trailer to ditch the T-X.
Not at all. That was a dance club.
It was a bar, notice the island bar where you buy drinks taking up the majority of the floor. That's where Kyle Reese is sitting and drinking. A dance club would want to have more open floor space, so no island bar.
And that wasn't a setup scene like the bar scenes were in T2 and T3. I'm trying to show how the T3 bar scene is a derivative of the one in T2, only really, really gay.
So, you're saying that because the T-800 got his clothes from a location where alcoholic beverages are served, then it's gay? That's funny, because Terminator 2 must be gay too, since there were a lot of references to things from Terminator in T2.
Not at all. That was the Terminator going directly after the police officers and kicking their ass. It wasn't like they were holed up inside somewhere fighting cops. And that scene rocked so much more than the one in T3 did, you cannot possibly deny it.
The only fundamental difference is that the cops were already inside the building in Terminator 1. You have the good guys trying to get out because of the bad terminator trying to kill them, cops running around being annoyingly dense and getting shot up, and the bad guy hunting them all down in the confusion. They're all three Cops getting in the way and creating a problem while the bad guy comes for the good guys scenes.
Haha, except she did. Think about this for a minute. "Hey officer, I have large breasts. I want your sex. CAN I HAVE YOUR GUN?" Give me a break.
Except see didn't. She never used a pistol. Who needs to think about something now?
That was CG. I know CG when I see it and it was very poorly done CG. Prove me wrong.
I just proved you don't know the difference between prop work and CG.
I know James Cameron wasn't involved. Which is why Linda Hamilton conveniently isn't in this one anymore. I just hate it when movies change directors or creative talent. It really shows. The directing wasn't nearly as artistic (Remember the burning playground at the opener of T2? That was infinitely more artistic than everything in T3 combined).
Then again, it's James Cameron who totally botched the time travel plot of the first two.
Hahahaha, that's funny, because they specifically state they're at the animal clinic at 5 in the morning on an emergency call, well before it opens. Wouldn't you think the terminators would go to her house first and see if she's at her home at 5 AM? I think they would. And I think this movie has more holes than swiss cheese.
The T-800 would know where to find her, because she programmed it. The T-X was responding to a police call. Duh.
Oh, believe me, I know why they made a female terminator. Which is why I think it's stupid. Yes, they wanted a woman for infiltration, blah blah blah. Doesn't convince me it was a good idea because she never used her sexuality to infiltrate!
Again, she did, GEENYOUS. You don't need a pistol if you have a gun arm! Think about it! Here's another thing to think about, pistol is a euphamism.
I don't really know how you could like the one in T3 any better. It was all the same type of stuff they did in T2. I liked it better in the Matrix because it had guns, kung fu, motorcycles, lots of cops (not stupid remote control cars) and it was longer and better directed. And it has better special effects.
So, you like the superficial shit?
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Post by Jack_Deth »

Saint... remember, you learned some of that from me ;)
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Post by Neon Dingo »

I feel the need to respond right now but my computer is totally fucked-up and I have to fix it or it will grow breasts and a lame-ass plasma cannon and shoot me.

But don't worry, I'll systematically tear your arguements apart (in the same Trekkie-esque way that we have been doing) all in good time.

"Fucking moron" my ass. Getting all worked up over something that doesn't even exist.

I find that hilarious that people have these heated debates over totally fictitious things that are entirely opinion-based.

But hey, I'm bored. And the female terminator was a bad idea. So have at you.
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Post by axelgreese »

Saint_Proverbius wrote:Except see didn't. She never used a pistol. Who needs to think about something now?
Not that I don't agree with you Saint, but iirc she uses a pistol in the animal clinic, to kill a few teenagers and the air force general guy.
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Post by axltrauts »

i just hope there is no john connor in FO3
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Post by atoga »

Saint seems to know Terminator as well as he knows Fallout... B)
suppose you're thinking about a plate of shrimp. suddenly somebody will say like 'plate' or 'shrimp' or 'plate of shrimp', out of the blue, no explanation.
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Post by Doyle »

bloodbathmaster2 wrote:Well, aside from the fact that humans live in nests in a post apocolyptic future, that few nests could communicate with eachother, and that the T-800s were a very early Terminator, there is simply the fact that he's Arnold.
They obviously can't be that scattered and separate, otherwise their couldn't really be an effective human resistance.
Literacy is overated.
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Post by BlackDog »

Neon = sw0ned. end of arguments. 8)
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Post by Fang_Teng »

Oh, I don't know, how about the whole bit about John Connor can not exist if Judgement Day never happens? The whole last hour of T2 was devoted to assfucking the series - changing something that can't possibly be changed
Ya, but isn't that just a reflection of Kyle Reese's quote: "No fate but what we make"?

Anyways, I don't think it screwed it up that much. Future John Connor must have realized it was inevitable, so he just decides to tell the Terminator to destroy Cyberdyne and Judgement day happens in 1997, in order to lie to his own mother in the past. This way, the true culprit could never be found, and Judgement Day will still occur. Because no matter what, Sarah would have targeted what she believed to be the source of Judgement Day.

At least this is what I got from this site: http://www.mjyoung.net/time/terminat.html

Terminator 2 could have ended with that happy ending with Sarah in the future, but luckily Cameron just did that dark street ending which at least allows for T3 to occur.
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Post by S4ur0n27 »

T-X doesnt really kick Arnold's ass. Arnold beats her up and make her go away. She comes back, she get kicked, except for that part where she corrupt his data. But that part doesnt make any sense. Didnt she changed the goal of his mission to killing Connor? Then Connor tells Arnold to remember his mission, but his mission is now to kill Connor. Wtf?. Anyway, me and my friend we gave points to Arnold and T-X for each fight, and at the end of the movie it was 9-6 Arnold I think :D

In another way : Arnold > T-1000 > T-X
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Post by Jack_Deth »

I think basically what TX did to Arnold was, made Arnold start running is older program... to kill Jon Connor, over his current one... protect Jon Connor/Kate Brewstah
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Post by Saint_Proverbius »

Fang_Teng wrote:Ya, but isn't that just a reflection of Kyle Reese's quote: "No fate but what we make"?

Anyways, I don't think it screwed it up that much. Future John Connor must have realized it was inevitable, so he just decides to tell the Terminator to destroy Cyberdyne and Judgement day happens in 1997, in order to lie to his own mother in the past. This way, the true culprit could never be found, and Judgement Day will still occur. Because no matter what, Sarah would have targeted what she believed to be the source of Judgement Day.

At least this is what I got from this site: http://www.mjyoung.net/time/terminat.html

Terminator 2 could have ended with that happy ending with Sarah in the future, but luckily Cameron just did that dark street ending which at least allows for T3 to occur.
The wya I see it, two things had to start everything in the series - and only these two things.. Judgement Day happens and Kyle Reese and a T-800 are sent back to 1984.

During the trip back, Kyle Reese hooks up with Sarah Connor for whatever reason. He tells her about the future. They have sex and John Connor is created, though he wasn't created for the first iteration of the loop. Kyle Reese is killed fighting the terminator.

Now, Sarah now knows that Judgement Day is coming. She also has a child. So, she begins preparing for Judgement Day. This also means that she prepares John for Judgement Day. As such, John is better prepared to become a leader after Judgement Day because he's been being prepared for it. Thus, John Connor becomes a leader.

Sarah also tells John that Reese is his father, so he always makes the trip back, regardless of how the timeline has changed. She insured he'll go back by telling him.

The only real problem left is the date of Judgement Day. Of course, John Connor knows when Sarah will die and he knows that she must prepare him for it. He could tell Reese to tell her that Judgement Day happens shortly before she dies, so she can die knowing that Judgement Day doesn't happen, even though he knows it does and knows the date. He also tells Reese that whole "No Fate" thing in order to give her hope, even though it's inevitable because John Connor exists. I mean, if John Connor exists, then Judgement Day must occur because it's responsible for him being born in the first place.

That's the only way I can see all that stuff working out.
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Post by axltrauts »

oh, i'm gonna puke...

the movie will be released here next week, so i'll just wait to see the end... but judgement day still occurs, i guess...
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Post by BlackDog »

Saint_Proverbius wrote:
Fang_Teng wrote:Ya, but isn't that just a reflection of Kyle Reese's quote: "No fate but what we make"?

Anyways, I don't think it screwed it up that much. Future John Connor must have realized it was inevitable, so he just decides to tell the Terminator to destroy Cyberdyne and Judgement day happens in 1997, in order to lie to his own mother in the past. This way, the true culprit could never be found, and Judgement Day will still occur. Because no matter what, Sarah would have targeted what she believed to be the source of Judgement Day.

At least this is what I got from this site: http://www.mjyoung.net/time/terminat.html

Terminator 2 could have ended with that happy ending with Sarah in the future, but luckily Cameron just did that dark street ending which at least allows for T3 to occur.
The wya I see it, two things had to start everything in the series - and only these two things.. Judgement Day happens and Kyle Reese and a T-800 are sent back to 1984.

During the trip back, Kyle Reese hooks up with Sarah Connor for whatever reason. He tells her about the future. They have sex and John Connor is created, though he wasn't created for the first iteration of the loop. Kyle Reese is killed fighting the terminator.

Now, Sarah now knows that Judgement Day is coming. She also has a child. So, she begins preparing for Judgement Day. This also means that she prepares John for Judgement Day. As such, John is better prepared to become a leader after Judgement Day because he's been being prepared for it. Thus, John Connor becomes a leader.

Sarah also tells John that Reese is his father, so he always makes the trip back, regardless of how the timeline has changed. She insured he'll go back by telling him.

The only real problem left is the date of Judgement Day. Of course, John Connor knows when Sarah will die and he knows that she must prepare him for it. He could tell Reese to tell her that Judgement Day happens shortly before she dies, so she can die knowing that Judgement Day doesn't happen, even though he knows it does and knows the date. He also tells Reese that whole "No Fate" thing in order to give her hope, even though it's inevitable because John Connor exists. I mean, if John Connor exists, then Judgement Day must occur because it's responsible for him being born in the first place.

That's the only way I can see all that stuff working out.
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Post by S4ur0n27 »

I say, smoke weed, enjoy an entertaining movie and stfu.
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Post by BlackDog »

s4ur0n27 wrote:I say, smoke weed, enjoy an entertaining movie and stfu.
and I say...drugs are bad. enjoy the movie without them, or get a life.
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Post by S4ur0n27 »

Wow, you are lame.
Smoking weed means I dont have a life?
Explain me wtf is a life and we'll see.
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Post by Fang_Teng »

*Eats popcorn and waits at the sidelines*

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Post by BlackDog »

s4ur0n27 wrote:Wow, you are lame.
Smoking weed means I dont have a life?
Explain me wtf is a life and we'll see.
It'd be a waste of my time to explain to you an answer to a question you should already know...or have the numerous drugs totally degraded the primary attributes of your brain? :roll: :badgrin:
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Post by EN. »

About the whole pistol/gun/sex thing with T-X...

I think T-X just seduced the policeman with the euphemism of the whole "I like your gun" and took his gun anyways as he was twitching in electrified orgasm (hey, he's having sex with a MACHINE... yeeech). Also, whoever said that pistol was the same one that the policeman had?

And is it just me, or did the ending feel almost just like Fallout? Everything from the Blast Door with that little door opening console thing resembling a simplified vault door, to the 30 year old computers...

I also think that what T-X did was take over T-800's BODY, instead of his CPU. Remember- she took over mechanical things like cars- I think that taking over simple mechanical things are the extent of her computer-take-over abilities- she can't take over a CPU.

Also, I think the creative part about T-X was the ability to take over machines- none of the previous terminators could do that. I mean, how far can you stretch it until it starts getting "creative" in your mind? A terminator made out of gas? A terminator that can transform into a mecha-ninja-godzilla? I think that should there be a terminator 4, then if there is an even more advanced model of the terminator, it would be able to become invisible. That's about all I can think about.
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