Life Imitates Art

ExtremeDrinker · Post by **ExtremeDrinker** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 5:12 am

"Kaaaaaahhhhhhhnnnnnn" - Captain James T Kirk.

It's sad that supreme genetics are cast in such a negative light. I've got some great genes in here somewhere. They're just a bit muddied by the twinkies, alcohol, and std's.

Ruben Rooben Reuben · Post by **Ruben Rooben Reuben** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 5:43 am

I look forward to the day that DNA becomes the next phrenology: discredited and out-of-date. When it happens, the hell is gonna come down because we're going to have to reinvent responsibility.

or not. I don't know, leave me the hell alone.

Dark_Machine · Post by **Dark_Machine** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 7:43 am

If you re-code the human gene to breed perfect genetic specimines of superiority, the perfect specimine is no longer superior, it's average. Then what? What will be considered superior then? Besides, in order to breed the "perfect" human being, you would have to remove the capacity to feel emotion, which would change us from human beings to something else. So you end up, not with a superior human, but an inferior something else.

Grey Fil · Post by **Grey Fil** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:52 am

Natural selection still applies, another form of selection invented by mankind also applies, social selection. Natural selection doesnt work like some people think, itÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s not physical strenght that counts, nor inteligence or a long life. ItÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s how many descendants you generate pure and simple. Bad ass dudes with an attitude or whatever only are selectively succesfull if they are capable of translating it into a social advantage in our modern world. People who go on a shooting spree or bullies who beat weaklings are probably more in danger than calm kids who do homework. ItÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s also useless to whine about how good life would be in another setting, whe live in the here and now, and itÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s what you do here and now that counts not what you would do if...

SuperH · Post by **SuperH** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 12:12 pm

Grey Fil wrote:Natural selection still applies, another form of selection invented by mankind also applies, social selection. Natural selection doesnt work like some people think, itÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s not physical strenght that counts, nor inteligence or a long life. ItÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s how many descendants you generate pure and simple. Bad ass dudes with an attitude or whatever only are selectively succesfull if they are capable of translating it into a social advantage in our modern world. People who go on a shooting spree or bullies who beat weaklings are probably more in danger than calm kids who do homework.

Not quite - kids who do homework are a lot more likely to have less kids then the outgoing bastard who takes his agressions out on other people. Cause they pressure women into making it with them, et cetera.

Grey Fil wrote:ItÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s also useless to whine about how good life would be in another setting, whe live in the here and now, and itÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s what you do here and now that counts not what you would do if...

That's pretty idealistic isn't it? Since when does what we do here count? If we can't picture a better life, then why are we allowed to have any imagination at all? Better to stop thinking and be a productive automaton, no?

OnTheBounce · Post by **OnTheBounce** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 12:19 pm

Franz_Schubert wrote:You want natural selection? A battle royale with handguns in the schoolyard isn't the way to go. Guns remove the point, it makes it so that any wimpy brat can kill a superior kid without any effort. Remove that equalizer, and tell the kids to just start beating the crap out of each other, and then the weaklings will be weeded out, and the strong will be left standing.

Why is it that so many people think that guns are some sort of equalizer? They are nothing of the sort.

Basically, what guns do is change the rules. Where some brawny, corn-fed motherfucker from Nebraska might have an advantage hand-to-hand, his bulk becomes a liability in a gunfight when he's just that much more of a target. Guns may change the balance in favor of fine motor skills versus gross motor skills, but do not make people equal.

There seems to be a vast misunderstanding of what exactly "natural selection" entails. What is does not entail is bigger, brawnier animals getting to pass on their genes. What it means is that whatever qualities that an organism posses that make it more suited to an environment mean it will be more likely to pass on its genes. That's it. There's nothing in there about bulging muscles or huge cocks.

In human terms this means that where a violent, physically strong and agile male might have won out over his competitors in 10,000 BCE that same combination of traits would likely not help him in 2,000 CE. There are no traits that are absolutely good, nor absolutely bad in this scheme. What makes an organism "fit" today could sound its deathknell tomorrow and vice-versa.

OTB

Grey Fil · Post by **Grey Fil** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 1:23 pm

Cause they pressure women into making it with them, et cetera.

How many kids do you know that are the result of women pressured by those outgoing bastards?

That's pretty idealistic isn't it? Since when does what we do here count? If we can't picture a better life, then why are we allowed to have any imagination at all? Better to stop thinking and be a productive automaton, no?

You completly lost the point, having ideals has nothing to do with what I meant. Imagination and ideals may be the motor that drives us but itÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s not what you do on your dreams that makes you a succesful reproducer of your genes.

Nor wishful thinking.

ExtremeDrinker · Post by **ExtremeDrinker** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 3:24 pm

I have no conscience. I've never had a little voice tell me "Maybe you shouldn't do that, Ryno..."

Megatron · Post by **Megatron** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 4:50 pm

What's the point in a ubermesch? Sure, you might weed out some of the disabled and feeble, but all you're left with are a few 'superior humans' and another 6 billion untermensch or whatever who might think, DANG BIYATCH DOSE CLONE MUTHAFUCKAZ GONNA TAKE OUT LEVIS DAWG or something. Forced evolution isn't the answer.

Isn't a deus ex machina something used in a play that saves the heroes just before the end? Like a lighting bolt hitting the villain just before he wins or something. Don't see how that has to do with anything besides that you play deus ex too much.

There's not much point either having 'LOL LETS HAVE BOTTLE RALLY! GIVE ERVYONE GUNZ LAST MAN STANDING WINZ' as this serves no purpose at all. If you wanted to kill a bunch of people, just kill them. If you want to get the best of the best, make them take years and years of tests until you liquidise their minds and bodys so you end up with someone not threatening your position. Sounds a bit like school though.

I don't see how we aren't evolving either. We still get mutations. We still die from each other, why not evolve. Life might be a lot easier but we need to evolve still. Mabye just quicker reaction times, better eye-sight, more nimble fingers. We've adapted our surroundings enough, now we just need to change ourselves? It's like having something that does the job, but wouldn't you like something better?

And tighter gun control is also pretty useless. It isn't working, criminals don't take notice of the law, so what's the point? And if you wanted to kill someone, there's plenty of other weapons lying around. People could argue it makes it easier, but if everyone had a gun, would people bother going on rampages if they knew that if they pulled a gun there'd be at least 5 other armed people nearby?

Weeeeeeee

Slave_Master · Post by **Slave_Master** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 5:04 pm

And tighter gun control is also pretty useless. It isn't working, criminals don't take notice of the law, so what's the point?

Right. If anything, give everybody guns, teach them how to use them, safely, and loosen the laws about deadly force in self defense a little bit.

Inin · Post by **Inin** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 6:25 pm

Damn Megatron, you actually worded a coherent, well-put together thought. Your annoyance factor just dropped considerably. Go for the brass ring, try and keep it at that level.

-Inin

iohkus · Post by **iohkus** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:35 am

no Inin.

Inin · Post by **Inin** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 4:43 am

(in a thick Scottish accent): No?

Wolfman Walt · Post by **Wolfman Walt** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 5:01 am

Slave_Master wrote: Right. If anything, give everybody guns, teach them how to use them, safely, and loosen the laws about deadly force in self defense a little bit.

I think I read somewhere that in Britian, even though guns are illegal, violent crime is at an all time high ((or like the highest it's been in 100 years, or something like that, I forgot the <i>exact</i> words used to describe it)).

Japan, who also has strict gun laws, would probably equally as high violent crime rates if not for afew things. A. The police are like somewhat like the Russian KGB, they can interview you until you co-operate. I forgot the exact laws, but once you're arrested, you're pretty screwed if your guilty and going to be in pain if not. B. Proffesional Crime ((Yakuza)) are pretty much left along. They mark their terroritory and thats pretty much it, police don't bother them unless need be.

Interestingly enough, Japan's most popular weapon for murdering someone is the weed knife.

Gun-Control - Doesn't help as much as people think. Violent crime will always occur, regardless of wether or not a gun is available.

Slave_Master · Post by **Slave_Master** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 5:19 pm

Gun-Control - Doesn't help as much as people think. Violent crime will always occur, regardless of wether or not a gun is available.

Yes. One of the fellows over at NMA was saying something like "BUT LOL IF U DONT HAV GUNS U KANT KIL 1242 PPL". Great logic, assuming that all gun-related homicides are part of a mass murder spree. Great logic.

Megatron · Post by **Megatron** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 5:27 pm

Wolfman Walt wrote:
Slave_Master wrote: Right. If anything, give everybody guns, teach them how to use them, safely, and loosen the laws about deadly force in self defense a little bit.
I think I read somewhere that in Britian, even though guns are illegal, violent crime is at an all time high ((or like the highest it's been in 100 years, or something like that, I forgot the <i>exact</i> words used to describe it)).

.

Yeah it's something like...350 a year? There is a way to legally get guns, but it's a lot of hassle. And you have to have a reason. Might seem small beans compared to the U.S, but you also have to think about the amount of people and shit, as well as the 2 countrys being...different. If you don't want guns so badly just move to japan or whatever, not much need to stop everyone else from having guns just because you go to college and know everything D:

I think the UK has the highest drug-use rate in europe, so the drug laws don't work either. Making something illegal just creates more crime if there's a need for it (not related to the item)? I don't know much about it, but I know most laws seem fucked up or something.

Cheese mate.

Slave_Master · Post by **Slave_Master** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 5:41 pm

Making something illegal just creates more crime if there's a need for it

Yeah. I can't wait until guns are banned in the States and a bunch of people get filthy fucking rich running guns in from Mexico or some other Central American country. Or they could just build guns in their garage. Either way, all the criminals will still get their firearms.

airsoft guy · Post by **airsoft guy** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 8:54 pm

There was a debate at another forum over gun control, might have even been this one, some idiot used the example of ray guns or blasters or some shit like that, they said that they have never heard of anyone being killed with laser blasters and such. Why? Because they don't exist! Exactly! Get rid of the guns and there would be no gun crime! No shit? But that would mean you would have to get EVERY gun and ALL the ammunition and ALL information regarding the manufacture of firearms and ammunition because firearms are exceedingly easy to build. Assuming you did get all that stuff away from us, that's not going to stop a whole lot of crime, people still have a billion other things lying around that can be used to kill. If all the guns are gone people will use knives, and a knife is a much harder weapon to master, along with martial arts, meaning the average person is defensless against any attack and must wait for the police to arrive.