self-defense? lol

[Doyle]

So basically I'm saying people should have the right to be free of worry of being shot in the head by a gun.

That's totally different, though. Smoking when used properly still damages people. When guns are used properly, they don't hurt anyone.

[Doyle]

I seriously doubt that making gun control stricter was a cause to more people having guns and using them for crime. I just think people are stupid and violent and want to shoot each other. So oh yeah, lets give them a better chance at doing it! woot. Legalize all the guns so anyone wanting to rob somebody can go to a store down the road and get a 9mm.

See, here's the thing. The English experience with gun control amply demonstrates that criminals don't have a problem getting weapons when they need to, even with tougher laws. So gun control only disarms people that wouldn't have misused the guns in the first place.

[airsoft guy]

I've also got the right not to be run over by a car, so let's ban those too, we don't need them anyways, we've got public transportation, I've also got a right now to be stabbed so lets ban knives, no scratch that, all sharp things, we can write with those giant crayons instead, because the citizens are incompetent and need to be treated like small children. Big brother? Nah, more like a nanny.

[Forty-six & Two]

I seriously doubt that making gun control stricter was a cause to more people having guns and using them for crime. I just think people are stupid and violent and want to shoot each other. So oh yeah, lets give them a better chance at doing it! woot. Legalize all the guns so anyone wanting to rob somebody can go to a store down the road and get a 9mm.

See, here's the thing though. The Enlish experience with Gun Control amply demonstrates that criminals don't have a problem getting weapons when they need to, even with tougher laws. So gun control only disarms people that wouldn't have misused the guns in the first place.

True. Very true. But can you truly tell me that flooding a country with guns is a way to end violence and crime...? Violence breeds violence. Simple as that. The only way to create peace is to be a pacifist, at least have a pacifistic wiew of life. That violence is not needed and that you can never rid it from the world by being violent yourself. On a longer time scale legalizing guns in a country that has had a preventive gun law in newer time will only see themselves in a worse and far more violent situation later on in time.

[Doyle]

Violence breeds violence. Simple as that. On a longer time scale legalizing guns in a country that has had a preventive gun law in newer time will only see themselves in a worse and far more violent situation later on in time.

Gun ownership doesn't have to be violent, though. I forget the exact number, but only something like 10% of the guns in America will ever be used in crime. Most of the guns will kill far more paper targets and watermelons than any animals or people.

You know, I see this argument a lot actually. In fact, a lot of anti-gunners used this argument when Florida was debating a right-to-carry law in the late 1980s. Right-to-carry laws, also called shall-issue concealed carry, require the state to issue concealed carry licenses to any applicant that passes the background checks. With a few exempted places like courthouses, these laws allow citizens in good standing to have firearms concealed on their person. A lot of people on the left claimed that this would cause crime rates to go up in Florida. They said it would become the "Gunshine State." In fact, a representative from the National Organization for Women made a statement almost exactly like yours. However, after the law passed, there was actually a reduction in crime rates accross the state. A program started in Dade county to track crimes committed by license holders was actually discontinued when there weren't any happening.

It's impossible to say for sure what happened in Florida, but it certainly doesn't look like concealed carry hurt them at all. There is a trend among people all over the world to shoot less as time goes on. As they have less experience with guns, it's much easier to be afraid of them, or to misunderstand them. However, there's no reliable data to indicate that loose gun laws cause high crime or death rates or that tough gun laws prevent any crime. Even among nations that have historically had low gun ownership rates, allowing guns to be owned won't suddenly change human nature.

[Mandalorian FaLLouT GoD]

or the police could just shoot whoever they see with a gun.

[Franz Schubert]

[Police]: Zat iz gun you have, jah?
[Guy]: Well, yes, but...
[Police]: GET INTO ZE CHAMBER!!

Of course I was slightly exaggerating here, but my idea is that if we strictly enforce the complete banning of guns, and bring extremely harsh penalties to people who have a gun, then there won't be so many deaths in the U.S.

Keep in mind, security guards should be able to get upgraded guns, just as an extra deterrant to crime.

PS: I'm a godan in Aikido, so I know all about self-defense.

[Forty-six & Two]

I've also got the right not to be run over by a car, so let's ban those too, we don't need them anyways, we've got public transportation, I've also got a right now to be stabbed so lets ban knives, no scratch that, all sharp things, we can write with those giant crayons instead, because the citizens are incompetent and need to be treated like small children. Big brother? Nah, more like a nanny.

Hmm. Thats a pretty useless analogy isnt it? Cars are a way of transportation. Knives, at least weed knives and such are made for weed work. Many other knives are made for pratical purposes also. And sharp "things"? Hmm. What are guns made for? Killing. They have no other prupose. So, comparing cars and guns as something to hurt people with are pretty ilogical. Of course some knives are made for killing, but they should be banned as well in my opinion, just as much as guns. We dont need things that are solely made for killing each other do we? But we need cars, to get around in our modern time consuming culture eh?

[Doyle]

Of course I was slightly exaggerating here, but my idea is that if we strictly enforce the complete banning of guns, and bring extremely harsh penalties to people who have a gun, then there won't be so many deaths in the U.S.

That's purely speculation. The English murder rate, despite historically being lower, is finally converging with the American rate. The trend in recent years is for the US rate to decrease while the English rate increases, even though there are more gun owners now in America than ever before.

[airsoft guy]

Yeah but the rest of us shlubs don't know any of that fancy shit, we know how to pull a hammer back and squeeze a trigger, that's all the martial arts I need.

[airsoft guy]

Not all fireamrs are for killing, some people own firearms because they like to shoot. What about target rifles? Those are designed to punch holes in paper accuratly, not kill people. Oh, but we dopn't need that, and we don't need cars either, because we have public transportation and instead of metal knives why not plastic ones instead? The gun control argument is fueled by idiots with idiot ideas.

[Franz Schubert]

That's totally different, though. Smoking when used properly still damages people. When guns are used properly, they don't hurt anyone.

Yes, but when guns are used improperly, and this happens quite frequently, people die.

I've also got the right not to be run over by a car, so let's ban those too, we don't need them anyways, we've got public transportation, I've also got a right now to be stabbed so lets ban knives, no scratch that, all sharp things, we can write with those giant crayons instead, because the citizens are incompetent and need to be treated like small children. Big brother? Nah, more like a nanny.

Now you're just being facetious. Guns are made for one purpose only, killing, which they do quite effectively. So you want to go out behind your trailer and fire bullets at a can?

Get a new hobby, I say.

[Doyle]

Yes, but when guns are used improperly, and this happens quite frequently, people die.

But the same is true with cars, knives and a lot of other items. Some terrorists misused box cutters and airplanes, which resulted in the largest mass-murder in American history. Plus, cars kill more people every year than guns.

[Franz Schubert]

we don't need cars either, because we have public transportation

No, we definitely need cars.

instead of metal knives why not plastic ones instead?

Plastic knives would be ghey, and besides that, they wouldn't be able to cut steak, and other things.

The gun control argument is fueled by idiots with idiot ideas.

no ur.

[Forty-six & Two]

Not all fireamrs are for killing, some people own firearms because they like to shoot. What about target rifles? Those are designed to punch holes in paper accuratly, not kill people. Oh, but we dopn't need that, and we don't need cars either, because we have public transportation and instead of metal knives why not plastic ones instead? The gun control argument is fueled by idiots with idiot ideas.

LoL. So an Uzi is made for practical puposes?! Oh yeah. That makes sense. Im so sorry. Youre right! I stand down!!

But seriously. Plastic knives? LoL. A weed knife can kill people, yes. But was a weed knife made for killing? No. Guns are. And people who like to shoot a gun? Well ok then, just because some people like to pop a few caps on the target range, people who enjoy killing others with guns should be able to do it, legally? And even though people have a gun and dont intent to kill with it, it was still made for that very purpose. Public transportation are just "big cars" and trains, they can run down people as well. You cant differentiate between cars and public transportation. What are you talking about anyeway..?

[airsoft guy]

Why should I get a new hobby? I havn't done anything wrong, I think you need to wake up and come out of your little fantasy world, you just don't seem to have a grasp on reality.

[airsoft guy]

Well then take guns away from the police and military too because they could just as easly go on a rampage as a bus driver.

[Franz Schubert]

But the same is true with cars, knives and a lot of other items. Some terrorists misused box cutters and airplanes, which resulted in the largest mass-murder in American history. Plus, cars kill more people every year than guns.

You guys need to STOP using that argument because it's been countered already. So what if cars kill more people than guns each year, THERE IS NO SUBSTITUTE FOR CARS, WE NEED THEM.

[Doyle]

And even though people have a gun and dont intent to kill with it, it was still made for that very purpose.

Is it? You know, there are well over 200 million guns in this country. A UN report recently found that we are approaching one gun for every person. Compared to the number of guns in private ownership, the number of people actually killed by guns in a given year is a very tiny percent. Less than 1% of the total gun ownership, actually. Considering that, I'd say the primary purpose of firearms is probably general target practice. Going out back and shooting cans, if you will.

[Doyle]

You guys need to STOP using that argument because it's been countered already. So what if cars kill more people than guns each year, THERE IS NO SUBSTITUTE FOR CARS, WE NEED THEM.

No, we don't. The segway revolutioned personal transportation. The future is now!