Killzone: PS2 Halo Killer?

Wolfman Walt · Post by **Wolfman Walt** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 7:18 pm

SuperH wrote:Aiming MIGHT BE easier with the mouse? How about "is undeniably" in place of that? Try circle strafing with a controller.

...I never had any troubles circle strafing with a controller......must be just me I guess. Regardless, you may wanna note that if these producers are any amount as genius as they claim, they'll include Mouse and keyboard support. Remember, a mouse and a keyboard CAN be hooked up to a PS2 as a majority of ps2 FPSs have done. Anotherwards, the controls could turn out just fine.

Hammer wrote:Nah, this won't be the "Halo 2 Killer" seeing as how it's on a PS2 it can't even begin to compete graphicaly with H2, nor will it be able to render in game the sheer amounts of vehicals, action, and graphics H2 will be able to render.

Lets not forget Xbox Live H2 support with Covenant versus Human combat.

Graphics do not a game make, gameplay does. Additionally, Killzone has afew advantages, first is realism. I like realism. The levels seem to be alot more focused according to interviews and such with developers. Each level will include something called a "Memorable event" which is like a rather large scripted sequence that will somehow dramatically impact the story or something. Last I remember, in Halo I had no dramatic events, as much as just wondering through giant levels hoping I was going the right direction with maybe afew scripted events; which GENERALLY were dumb aliens doing something, or my fellow marines doing something. Sheer amount of Vehicles? Action? Graphics? Geese Hammer, you really don't give the ps2 enough credit. Apperantly Jak 2 proves you wrong on the vehicles part as in the hub there are atleast 20+ vehicles flying around onscreen at anytime. Action? Egh, I don't remember there being as much action in Halo as you claim, but if you remember Medal Of Honor Frontline for PS2 and the recreated Pearl Harbor scene (And keep in mind this was made a year or so ago) which had alot of action (Scripted or not) occuring at the same time. Graphics wise? Apperantly according to people who saw/played/whatever during the showings at E3, the graphics already are just as good as Halo 2. Ofcourse, I don't trust them exactly, but its still interesting.

Also, I hate Xbox Live, but regardless, I'm sure SONY can provide just as good Internet service. Maybe they'll let Square take over, since Square has a good service with Play Online, which is what will be handling FFXI.

The Gaijin · Post by **The Gaijin** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:20 pm

It'll probably be better than Halo II simply because it won't be so fucking technicolor. However, since it won't have vehicles (that drive like they're on an iceflow at all times) and it's not Halo I doubt it'll kill much of anything. Still worth a look.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:13 am

Since a few people mentioned how Halo II will look "Technicolor" or too fake, I direct you to some pictures from an early build of the game.

http://halo.bungie.net/site/halo/featur ... ots01.html

Take a look at that, those don't look like plastic, Technicolor garbage. Real time reflections in the visor as well as bump mapping, realistic dynamic lighting, and other graphical technologies ensure that H2 will not only look better then Kill Zone, but also provide a more realistic looking environment.

Graphics do not a game make, gameplay does.

No but graphics ensure sales, put Genforge out there against any new, top of the line graphic RPGs out there and I guarantee you people will be more willing to pick that off the shelves. Why? Because Genforge looks like a bargain bin piece of shit.

I like realism. The levels seem to be allot more focused according to interviews and such with developers.

Realism to what extent? Realism within a Science Fiction universe? If you want realism go play the Rainbow Six series of games because you'll find a hell of a lot more there then you will in Kill Zone, if you're even going to argue realism in a fictional game set in a Science Fiction universe I ask you how exactly is it realistic?

since it won't have vehicles (that drive like they're on an iceflow at all times)

Anybody who has played Halo would agree it has one of the best vehicle physics systems going for it, from the way the Warthog's suspension reacts to terrain to the Scorpion tank bolted back when it fires its massive main gun.

Oh the topic of ice, sliding on the ice in Halo was also well designed piece of physics.

Last I remember, in Halo I had no dramatic events, as much as just wondering through giant levels hoping I was going the right direction with maybe a few scripted events; which GENERALLY were dumb aliens doing something, or my fellow marines doing something

So this game is not going to have ANY scripting to make these memorable events? Halo's memorable events include these just to name a few.

1. The last stand defense at one of the towers in the second mission

2. First encountering the flood after wondering through the creepy swamp level, Fuckin' A that level was filled with mystery and memorable moments. Even seeing the fate of Jenkins's squad through the helmet's video cam was something I'd consider memorable and plot forwarding.

3. Reinforcing the Marines on the "Assault on the control room" mission and staging an assault with the Scorpion tank while Infantry supported you was also one of my memorable moments.

4. The D-Day like raid on the beach head in the "Silent Cartographer" mission was also a very memorable event, both visually satisfying and action packed.

5. Finding the fate of your Captain in the "Keyes" mission, a character which was developed and unfortunately slain.

6. Fighting your way to the cruiser in the "Truth and Reconciliation" mission was memorable, from fighting and pushing forward to the teleport, all the way to beaming up and sneaking through the halls of the Alien ship with the other Marines. Then of course there was the escape you had to make from that ship with the Captain and other survivors.

This game was filled with memorable moments, scripted? Yes, but I garun-a-tee you that any 'memorable' event in that game will also be scripted and on par with every other FPS game short of Half-Life 2.

which is like a rather large scripted sequence that will somehow dramatically impact the story or something

I seem to recall first discovering the Flood a dramatic event which changed the story.

eese Hammer, you really don't give the ps2 enough credit. Apperantly Jak 2 proves you wrong on the vehicles part as in the hub there are atleast 20+ vehicles flying around onscreen at anytime.

Jak2 has subpar graphics compared to Halo, you that many vehicles with the level of Halo 1 or 2's graphics, throw in some action for good measure, and I guarantee you will see a frame hit.

Also, I hate Xbox Live, but regardless, I'm sure SONY can provide just as good Internet service. Maybe they'll let Square take over, since Square has a good service with Play Online, which is what will be handling FFXI.

FFXI Has been in Japan for what, a year? For such a wonderful, monumental game it sure doesn't seem to be making much of a splash in the United States.

As far as MMOG goes you know which one I support.

Thematically, it looks to be a hell of a lot better than Halo 2. The imagery to me is a lot better looking in general. It may not be as shiny as Halo 2, but it won't degrade the game in general. Silent Hill is still better than most survival horror games, even with its cruddy graphics.

Thematically is a matter of opinion, I consider guerilla warfare through a war torn, post apocalyptic Earth with a band of human soldiers better in theme and atmosphere then anything Killzone has to offer.

Halo didn't really do that much overall. Unless you want to call the huge boring levels like the library 'action' instead of pure unadulterated boredom.

One bad mission, while I can see the point of it and where it would appeal to people who like DOOM, it did not appeal to me.

I'm not convinced anything needs to be a halo 2 killer, because Halo2 hasn't been released to actually know if it's worth killing yet.

It can't be killed and that's that. Halo was and is the most successful new generation console FPS going, KillZone might be the best PS2 action game, but won't hold a candle to Halo 2 in sales.

iohkus · Post by **iohkus** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:19 am

fuck halo. go savage

Nuclear Gandhi · Post by **Nuclear Gandhi** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:23 am

Yeah, I used to be "OMG Halo!" but now I'm just like "Meh, it's just Halo, I'll go play some repetitive Diablo 2." That statement should tell you what I think of Halo.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:28 am

It, like every other statement you make, tells me you're a moron and nothing else.

Nuclear Gandhi · Post by **Nuclear Gandhi** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:30 am

TOUCHE' looks like I didn't see that one coming from the likes of you!

Go play your Halo.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:32 am

Only if you promise to go and continue being a moron.

Mandalorian FaLLouT GoD · Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:35 am

halo is not, i repeat, is not the be all end all action game for any console system.

halo isnt so hardcore l33t that nothing can touch it. it sells because the average console gamer is amazed by "JIOSJHDIOSJOIDJSIOJ" l33t graphics but the average console gamer plays tony hawk so go figure.

with halo you play one mission then go online to shoot someone else much like everyone did with Fallout Tactics.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:37 am

Such a great post, all the reviews of Halo for Xbox were all pluses, you can say that "reviews don't make the game" but when the vast majority of reviewers settle on the fact that the game "Is a step above the rest" that means something.

Mandalorian FaLLouT GoD · Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:39 am

if the rest is composed of shitty tony hawk games and BMXXX does being a step above the rest mean anything?

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:41 am

In what, genre? Those games might be a stemp above the rest in Sports racing or whatever the fuck genre they fit in.

iohkus · Post by **iohkus** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:53 am

halo is a straight up first person shooter

nothing more, nothing less

if u like deathmatch / ctf / team deathmatch then you'd probably like halo

if you're looking for something more engaging than straight up deathmatch u won't be impressed

that's why u got people like sony, epic games, s2games trying to expand fps genre into base vs. base and make it more engaging overall

Wolfman Walt · Post by **Wolfman Walt** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 1:57 am

Hammer wrote:Take a look at that, those don't look like plastic, Technicolor garbage. Real time reflections in the visor as well as bump mapping, realistic dynamic lighting, and other graphical technologies ensure that H2 will not only look better then Kill Zone, but also provide a more realistic looking environment.

Although the PS2 cannot handle bump mapping, I'm pretty sure that it can handle dynamic lighting as I've seen afew games brag about such. Next isn't the fact wether the environments look realistic (or atleast my argument) its the fact that the actions, characters, ideas, plot, etc weren't exactly the most realistic in Halo.

No but graphics ensure sales

We weren't talking about sales here, we were talking about the quality of the game. Also we may want to note, if something has horrible gameplay but good graphics, it shall probably end up in a bargain bin right away. Games like Street Fighter and such, however, don't have all sorts of new fangled graphics or anything and still are considered very good sellers. Its because its a solid game. One of the reasons Halo sold was because it had good gameplay along with its graphics. If it was just a benchmark piece, it would have wreaked.

If you're even going to argue realism in a fictional game set in a Science Fiction universe I ask you how exactly is it realistic?

Because its based on proven science, weapon technology, lacks aliens, and is human against human?

So this game is not going to have ANY scripting to make these memorable events? Halo's memorable events include these just to name a few.

They'll be scripted, and they'll be one in every level. You took memorable too literal as well. According to the developers, they'll be major and more like the bigger ones you described, but will have more of an impact on storyline, not just directly to your character, but the whole war. Ofcourse, you have the one up on me here, because even though I enjoyed Halo, I don't own it and can't really say much as to what the Killzone events will be.

This game was filled with memorable moments, scripted? Yes, but I garun-a-tee you that any 'memorable' event in that game will also be scripted and on par with every other FPS game short of Half-Life 2.

Agreed

I seem to recall first discovering the Flood a dramatic event which changed the story.

I seem to recall first discovering the Flood as a rather annoying thing which didn't really change much in my eyes. Although it did give me plenty of excuse to use my shotgun repeatidly.

Jak2 has subpar graphics compared to Halo, you that many vehicles with the level of Halo 1 or 2's graphics, throw in some action for good measure, and I guarantee you will see a frame hit.

It depends on who you ask. People who own a PS2 and a X-Box that I've talked to thus far feel that Jak2's incity graphics are on par with any X-Box title. Also, theres plenty of developer techniques that have been in development as to garuntee that there will not be a frame hit.

FFXI Has been in Japan for what, a year? For such a wonderful, monumental game it sure doesn't seem to be making much of a splash in the United States.

So how come it seems that everyone I've talked to thats really played it seem to be forgetting things like eating, sleeping, and work?

It can't be killed and that's that. Halo was and is the most successful new generation console FPS going, KillZone might be the best PS2 action game, but won't hold a candle to Halo 2 in sales.

God damn prophets, always predicting this and that! Although I will give you this, Halo is a prozen franchise and as such will have fans who know it will be enjoyable. Killzone is a new entry. On the other hand though, more people own Playstation 2s then X-Boxs....so you got alot to consider.

Two things worth mentioning, first is that the "dramatic" events will be viewed through the eyes of the four selectable characters (each with their own type of specialty or something), so (unlike Halo) you get four differant storylines, increasing replayability.

Next, I don't even think Killzone has been announced for the US yet (This is going off of information from 2 weeks ago, it could have changed) but only from Europe. Although I think we can all agree that with the hype boost this game is receiving, it'de be fairly moronic for them not to release this game internationally. I'de hate to buy a PAL playstation just so I can run afew games.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:02 am

Although the PS2 cannot handle bump mapping, I'm pretty sure that it can handle dynamic lighting as I've seen afew games brag about such. Next isn't the fact wether the environments look realistic (or atleast my argument) its the fact that the actions, characters, ideas, plot, etc weren't exactly the most realistic in Halo.

They might not have been "realistic" in the half-assed way you mean it, but they sure as shit were unique. Also Halo's animations were top notch, when you made a hard turn on the Warthog the gunner in the back would fluently sway with it, or when you hit a bump he'd hold on tighter or shift his weight in a way that would ensure his continued occupation of the vehicle through hazardous terrain.

The plot of Halo was unique in the way that it added and expanded upon notion of this artificial ring world being used for many things, not just being a weapon. Also I don't remember any other games or movies being set on an artificial, unique ring world.

We weren't talking about sales here, we were talking about the quality of the game. Also we may want to note, if something has horrible gameplay but good graphics, it shall probably end up in a bargain bin right away.

But we are talking about "The Killer" - what will determine it being "The Halo Killer" is sales, understand sun shine?

Because its based on proven science, weapon technology, lacks aliens, and is human against human?

That is not what most people mean when saying a game is "realistic." Most if not all would consider realistic things to be modern day weapons, critical hit zones, tactical commands and movement, basically Rainbow Six.

What you mention is not realism persay, but rather a believable science-fiction universe.

They'll be scripted, and they'll be one in every level. You took memorable too literal as well. According to the developers, they'll be major and more like the bigger ones you described, but will have more of an impact on storyline, not just directly to your character, but the whole war. Of course, you have the one up on me here, because even though I enjoyed Halo, I don't own it and can't really say much as to what the Killzone events will be.

According to the developers of Diakatna........

I seem to recall first discovering the Flood as a rather annoying thing which didn't really change much in my eyes. Although it did give me plenty of excuse to use my shotgun repeatidly.

The Flood opened up possibilities within the story and possible explanations to the existence of Halo, prior to meeting the flood we had no idea why we were on Halo or why the Covenant wanted it. Were the flood as fun to fight? no, not really, but looking back on it I am glad they were introduced because it opened up a whole lot in terms of plot.

It depends on who you ask. People who own a PS2 and a X-Box that I've talked to thus far feel that Jak2's incity graphics are on par with any X-Box title. Also, theres plenty of developer techniques that have been in development as to garuntee that there will not be a frame hit.

Yeah if you ask die hard PS2 fans they'll say it's on par, ask any bias owner of both systems with an ounce of brains and they'll say pound for pound the Xbox is not only more powerful, but the vast majority of it's games produce much more visually appealing effects.

So how come it seems that everyone I've talked to thats really played it seem to be forgetting things like eating, sleeping, and work?

So why is it not taking the MMORPG universe by storm? EverQuest still beats the living shit out of it, and with EQ2 coming out Final Fantasy 93 will be stomped in to extinction, unfortunately so will PlanetSide.

God damn prophets, always predicting this and that! Although I will give you this, Halo is a proven franchise and as such will have fans who know it will be enjoyable. Killzone is a new entry. On the other hand though, more people own Playstation 2s then X-Boxs....so you got alot to consider.

Yeah that prophet thing is real fucking cute, but lets take in to account what this prophet did.

Hype - In the console world Halo 2 one of the biggest titles coming, if not THE biggest. Constant promotion aids this.

Bungies record - Bungie is a company that has for the most part always delivered and topped games previously thought unstoppable, when I first heard H2 was coming I thought "Nah aint gonna top it" but then I seen the E3 Trailer with the war in the city.....

Previous Halo sales - Halo had the most sales of any next generation console game I believe, if not the most it was pretty high up there, I guarantee you the vast majority of Halo buyers will be picking up Halo 2.

Xbox Sales - Sales are on the rise, and with Halo 2 coming this will help it as well.

Xbox Live - You may hate it but a shit load of people love it, and the subscribers to it are hella high. They're always looking for new online content and when this mother fucker hits the shelves, they're gonna try it even if they never played or liked the original Halo.

Two things worth mentioning, first is that the "dramatic" events will be viewed through the eyes of the four selectable characters (each with their own type of specialty or something), so (unlike Halo) you get four differant storylines, increasing replayability.

That will be cool - however, how actual playability of the game will be subtracted to get 4 different ones? All in all you will probably come out with a game the same length as Halo 2 even counting in all 4 possible stories.

Nuclear Gandhi · Post by **Nuclear Gandhi** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:08 am

Actually, I hope Killzone doesn't become the Halo type popular. It is a good game, but all those "diehard Halo" idiots that play it night after night need a bullet. The same demographic as CS.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:09 am

Yeah so you can be totally kewl and be part of a cute little group of kids who play this totally kewl secret game right?

Go have a fucking tea party you swell guy.

Nuclear Gandhi · Post by **Nuclear Gandhi** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:15 am

Better than:

"OMG i so killd yuo with my glock! nub suck yo mommas dic"

Franz Schubert · Post by **Franz Schubert** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:43 am

Personally, I think Halo is very well made. It's a quality game all around, and fun. And I also think Counterstrike is extremely fun, though the interface is quite buggy.

The only problem I have with CS is that all the people who play it are whiny little bitches. I prefer playing LAN with my friends because of this.

iohkus · Post by **iohkus** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 8:06 am

yes, LAN will always own internet gaming.

makes the game atleast 2x as much fun