The AK74 is a nice gun

[slapshot]

I'm far too lazy for any of that commando stuff! I saw a man cut his hand on a broken table on the 5:45 train to Paddington once, does that count?

yes that counts, if you count the time I saw a moron saw his fingers off with a band saw in high school.

Caio

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[Canis Lupus]

yes that counts, if you count the time I saw a moron saw his fingers off with a band saw in high school.

Superb.

Also, AKs are great if you want a gun that jams every fifteen rounds with a safety switch that's so loud it gives away your position. Apart from the fact that the Western World has decent weaponry, we probably won all these recent wars because the Enemy could only afford AKs.

[trythebill]

yes that counts, if you count the time I saw a moron saw his fingers off with a band saw in high school.

Superb.

Also, AKs are great if you want a gun that jams every fifteen rounds with a safety switch that's so loud it gives away your position. Apart from the fact that the Western World has decent weaponry, we probably won all these recent wars because the Enemy could only afford AKs.

okay, now we have heard from the verbal bullshit crowd. good to get that out of the way early.

p.s. time-out. what the hell are you doing to your AK that it is jamming every half a mag?

p.p.s. put a zip-tie or wrap electrical tape around that safety and stop being a little bitch already.

[slapshot]

AKs are great if you want a gun that jams every fifteen rounds

Never seen any AK47, AKM, or AK74 jam on a consistent basis they are all pretty durable weapons and eat ammumition greedily but they do need to be cleaned once in awhile. I had the opportunity to FAM fire an AKM copy made by hand in Dara Pakistan and it was a sweetheart.

a safety switch that's so loud it gives away your position.

I suppose thats important for stealth boys and delta force types but by and large you wont notice the sound of your safety clicking because there will be too much gunfire and chaos going on around you the instant the shooting starts.

Apart from the fact that the Western World has decent weaponry, we probably won all these recent wars because the Enemy could only afford AKs

Actually man portable rifles pistols and machine guns account for perhaps
10%- 15% of the casulties generated in a conflict. I think the fact that we always have air supremacy, smart bombs, ATGM's, cluster bombs, FAE bombs, massed artillery, MLRS systems and WELL TRAINED TROOPS is the reason we stomp ARAB armies so easily, they are the worst soldiers in the world.

It seems to me that Russians, Serbians, Ukrainians, Polish and all the former warsaw pact nations use AK variants and they are far from the push over sissies that the Arabs are. should we ever find ourselves in a REAL shooting war with any of the slavic nations that I just mentioned especially Russia you would see that they would do quite a bit of damage with their somewhat dated and less than perfect weaponry. Remember in ground combat the mind of commited soldier is the most lethal thing he is equipped with.

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[Wolfman Walt]

I always thought that AK's were some of the most reliable and rugged rifles around. Infact, I know thats true. Maybe you're thinking of the original M-16 which to my knowledge had a real bad jamming problem which gave it the reputation in Vietnam as being unreliable.

[Canis Lupus]

I always thought that AK's were some of the most reliable and rugged rifles around. Infact, I know thats true. Maybe you're thinking of the original M-16 which to my knowledge had a real bad jamming problem which gave it the reputation in Vietnam as being unreliable.

Maybe I was thinking of the original M16; I know there's one modern rifle that is/was widely used that jams all the time. But it sure as Hell isn't the Steyr.

PS: There's also something I don't trust about guns with wood finishes - some of them look damn nice, but for some reason I don't like it too much.

[trythebill]

I always thought that AK's were some of the most reliable and rugged rifles around. Infact, I know thats true. Maybe you're thinking of the original M-16 which to my knowledge had a real bad jamming problem which gave it the reputation in Vietnam as being unreliable.

Maybe I was thinking of the original M16; I know there's one modern rifle that is/was widely used that jams all the time. But it sure as Hell isn't the Steyr.

PS: There's also something I don't trust about guns with wood finishes - some of them look damn nice, but for some reason I don't like it too much.

you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. not even a little bit. not one iota.

this is a problem and i know how to handle it.

where's my goddamn admiral hat, i'll take care of this right now.

[Wolfman Walt]

I plan on getting wood grips for my Ruger. I personally like weapons with wood, its better then weapons that say "Mattel" on them atleast.

[Viktor]

I'm far too lazy for any of that commando stuff! I saw a man cut his hand on a broken table on the 5:45 train to Paddington once, does that count?

yes that counts, if you count the time I saw a moron saw his fingers off with a band saw in high school.

Caio

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Err... Umm... Sorry 'bout that - too much caffeine, too little sleep...

[Viktor]

Viktor is armed with the most dangerous weapon ever, razor sharp wit and intelligence.

Now if I could just learn a bit of restraint and understanding, I'd be a force to be reckoned with!

[Viktor]

No thanks. I prefer Jane's Defence Weekly when I can blag a copy...

No argument there I used to steal them out of S2 every chance I got.

now I have to rely old Ian Hogg and a few others for light reading

I did me some digging and it appears that I was in error in that the Russians were working on version of the 7.62 x 39 necked down to 6mm that would have been sweet. I take it that they ran out of cash when the wall came down and reverted to as you say what they had the most of and thats obviously 7.62x 39 that they have mountains of in storage.

In reality when you compare the accuracy of any AK variant with an M16A2 your L85A2 , HK, or FN the Russians come off as a distant second best. But if I was packing an AK74 in combat I would feel well armed despite its foibles.


Note:I think its pretty clever how you guys took the armalite AR 18 and turned it into a facsimile of the EM2. I wish the EM2 had been produced in numbers and in the 6mm cal.

note: I like the way the Russians package their ammo. The galvanized hermetically sealed cans that open with a key like a ham are my favorites. they are almost indestrustable until opened.

Note: I will never understand why you guys dont have an equivalent of our second ammendment written into your bill of rights.

Caio

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Ah, the late, great Ian V. Hogg. The thinking man's gun writer! One day, I hope to have a copy of everything he wrote...

Shorter effective range and very average accuracy no problem if you employ the same mechanised infantry tactics the Russians use. Overwhelming firepower and maneouver to keep the enemy pinned down until heavy weapons take them out is very effective. Having at least one SVD rifle per squad means they have the capabillity to take out point targets out to 800 metres anyway. The British use the L86 LSW (long barrelled SA-80 with bipod) in a very simial role - accurate fire support out beyond the range of the issue battle rifle

One complaint levelled against the M4A1 in Iraq was that it couldn't provide effective point or suppressing fire out past 400 meters - not suprising as the M16A2 is rated at 550 metres and the M4A1's barrel is 27% shorter. The US Army units who have Designated Marksmen with M14s found these very handy in the open desert as they don't normally have the Scout/Sniper teams with M40As or M82s that your USMC use to great effect.

The EM2 and the 4.85mm Individual Weapon were great designs but were never adopted due to NATO standardisation of the 5.56mm SS109 round. As this round was intended to fight WW3 against body armour equipped troops, it's armour piercing capabilities are excellent at the expense of "knock down" lethallity. It's just a damn shame the contract to make the SA-80 went to the lowest bidder and all sorts of Army politics got involved! The XL70 prototypes were lovely bits of kit, but the mass produced SA-80 was very shoddily built and early ones fell apart in normal use. It's taken H&K 3 years and a lot of money to actually make an acceptable weapon in the shape of the A2 version - which is still a bitch to keep clean, but at least it doesn't fall apart! The new magazines help although the British troops "borrowed" M16 magazines from US forces every chance they got!

As for "the right to keep and bear arms" in the UK, before WW1, the government "looked forward to the day that there was a rifle in every cottage across the land". With the disaffected veterans returning from France in 1918, the trouble in Ireland and growing popular support for Communism across Europe; the government decided a well armed electorate which could vote with bullets rather than ballots might not be in their best interests and successive governments have followed this trend with ever more restrictive firearms legisation.

[slapshot]

Yes Ian Hogg's tomes hold a place of honor in my collection. I to would like to own everything he ever wrote about small arms.

Its really a shame that the EM2 didn't become the NATO standard rifle, but it was ahead of its time and plagued by a US military that wanted to force its (at the time) archaic theories of individual combat on NATO. The M14 is a great rifle but in no way was it up to the task of holding the job of an assault rifle. The SLR was closer to the mark but still it was hard to handle when on full auto.

My loadings of the 7 x 30 Waters with 139grain slugs is similar in performance (not quite as hot) to the .280 British that would have been used on the EM2. The low recoil and high velocity of the .280 round combined with the bullpup straight line design of the EM2 would have given NATO a decided advantage over the Soviets. Instead the Soviets had an advantage with the AK47 and its intermediat power ammo.


On a side note:

My favorite guns bar none are my 2 single shot peabody Martini's. I have had the actions upgraded with target weight barrels for 7mm x 30 waters (a .30-30 necked down to 7mm) and .303 british respectivly. The simplicity and durability of these old 1880's actions is astounding as is the instantanious lock time. These old reworked rifles are every bit as accurate as the new crop of tactacal rifles on the market today.

I would feel ccompletely comfortable taking the .303 Martini with its BSA target scope into combat provided that I had an UZI as a back up for close in work. The .303 Martini with hand loads has less than 1moa of random dispersion meaning that it can print a 10inch group at 1000 yards, assuming of course that I can call the wind and mirage correctly.
(thats a big assumption )

At this time I am creating a sprite for the single shot .303 Martini sniper rifle to be used in FOT. And I just might make a .280 EM2 sprite and ammo as well.

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