Bethsada isn't a bad company

Screaming_Dude_in_Vegas · Thu May 12, 2005 9:44 pm

Hey, I'm new hear, but I've been browsing the sight for a bit, and it seems that most people hear consider bethsada to be some half-assed company that makes entirely sucky games that are worthless.

I just want to point out that fallout is probably the best RPG ever made, and that prettymuch anything looks bad compared to it. But in terms of the type of game, that is, a single player RPG where you do whatever the hell you want, there are only 2 franchises, TES and Fallout. I much rather have it stay with a company who knows what makes the game good (open endedness) rather than some other RPG company.

Morrowind was a fine game. Fallout was better. But morrowind was probably better than most RPGs out their. Sure it was easy to exploit some of the flaws, but no one was forcing you. No one ever forced you to play with only one character either.

Although I wish Interplay had kept fallout, bethsada was the best choice to sell it to.

Nicolai · Post by **Nicolai** » Thu May 12, 2005 10:26 pm

I've never said that Bethesda was a bad company, I'm even looking forward to Fallout 3.

S4ur0n27 · Post by **S4ur0n27** » Thu May 12, 2005 10:41 pm

Morrowind SUCKED

Haris · Post by **Haris** » Thu May 12, 2005 10:48 pm

As long as they leave out mutant prostitutes and tribals they will do fine. Sloppy ghoul action and Nanuks little tribal just sounds wrong.

S4ur0n27 · Post by **S4ur0n27** » Thu May 12, 2005 11:27 pm

I don't think you're one to define what is and isn't cannon.

Screaming_Dude_in_Vegas · Fri May 13, 2005 1:07 am

Morrowind was a transition from a prettymuch completely random, yet huge world (daggerfall), to becoming more focused and doing more stuff by hand. So basicaly they were afraid of not having enough "content", so they rushed in a ton of crappy "fed-ex" quests. Now I think bethsada has learned their lesson, as you can tell from some of their interviews on Oblivion (fewer quests, but they'll actually be ones you'll want to play, with multiple methods, just like the FO quests).

Also, at least morrowind wasn't liniar. I mean aside from fallout, it is the only RPG that is truely open ended. Not as in "Multiple endings", but as in, you go anwhere, do anything. At least bethsada has expeirience with this type of game. I mean it's better than peter malanuxe buying it, blizard, or god forbid, EA.

Point is, if it has to go to another company, who would you rather it be?

Post by **King of Creation** » Fri May 13, 2005 2:01 am

Most of us would say Troika, but they basically don't exist anymore. Other than that, there really only only a handful of companies that could handle it without butchering it completely, Obsidian and Bethesda. It's really a crapshoot at this point. With so few decent RPG houses out there, and with the best one dead (Black Isle), I can't really think of a better place for Fallout than Bethesda. I'd probably say no to Obsidian just because Feargus hates all of us, and would make the game suck out of spite. Point is, Bethesda has the resources, skill, talent, and apparently a great desire to make Fallout 3.

Dagon · Post by **Dagon** » Fri May 13, 2005 7:28 am

please GOD don't allow them to make F3 fpp game :/.
Even RT i could resist but no fpp

PiP · Post by **PiP** » Fri May 13, 2005 11:59 am

King of Creation wrote: Point is, Bethesda has the resources, skill, talent, and apparently a great desire to make Fallout 3.

3 cheers!

Post by **DarkUnderlord** » Fri May 13, 2005 12:41 pm

Screaming_Dude_in_Vegas wrote:Also, at least morrowind wasn't liniar. I mean aside from fallout, it is the only RPG that is truely open ended. Not as in "Multiple endings", but as in, you go anwhere, do anything. At least bethsada has expeirience with this type of game.

Hey, woah there! Don't confuse "open-ended" with "non-linearity". They're two different kettles full of two different types of fish. Morrowind was as linear as hell. You HAD to do the XYZ before you got the ABC and then talk to JFK before you could approach NOP and so on, right through the entire main quest.

If you walked into the Bad Dudes Lair before you'd done all of that, you got a voice saying "D00d WTF, UR not rdy!!1!". Compared to Fallout where right from the start, you can meander over to the Military Base and give 'em hell. Then waltz down to the Cathedral and give them hell too. Of course, you'd die horribly because you're only a level 1 but there were no limits preventing you from finishing the game when you were ready. The only reason you followed the main plot was because that's the only way to find things out for the first time. I've often played a game of Fallout where I simply stumbled into one ending or another because I didn't want to go through the main quest "by the book" again.

Compare that to Morrowind where you have to go through the hocus pocus to be named Neveravine (even forcing you to do slavery and what-not in their badly designed non-multiple solution quests), then talking to that God d00d, then trying to remember who you sold that ph4t hammer too because you thought it was cursed but nooo... it's a significant part of the plot. Even if you kill the Voodoo God floating in his temple, you get a useless trinket and the "You fucked the game up!" message.

Though admittedly, if you knew of it, there was a guy in some place or another you could talk to whereby you could actually finish the game. If you knew about that, that is. Mostly when I got that message, I reloaded. God Forbid I get stuck in a game that never ends.

Post by **King of Creation** » Fri May 13, 2005 4:15 pm

PiP wrote:
King of Creation wrote: Point is, Bethesda has the resources, skill, talent, and apparently a great desire to make Fallout 3.
3 cheers!

Notice my careful wording.

PiP · Post by **PiP** » Fri May 13, 2005 5:46 pm

no, I mean it. I'm trying to be optimistic. But wait, MMRW will come and say F3 is gonna suck ass (not that I depreciate his valuable input). Ah well, we'll see, but I find some truth in what you write, and that is an encouraging thought.

S4ur0n27 · Post by **S4ur0n27** » Fri May 13, 2005 8:48 pm

We'll probably get a Fallout 3 that, stand-alone, would be a good game. But being a Fallout it would make it suck the shit.

Haris · Post by **Haris** » Fri May 13, 2005 10:36 pm

I don't think you're one to define what is and isn't cannon.

Apperently you dont get that my mods are not the part of the fallout series. And that means that they got nothing to do with me defining what is cannon.

Nicolai · Post by **Nicolai** » Fri May 13, 2005 10:44 pm

.. What?

St. Toxic · Post by **St. Toxic** » Sat May 14, 2005 2:44 am

Well now, I wouldn't say the Nazis were a bad company either.
Everyone is good at something or other, and the right guys for the right gig is the aim of the game.

POOPERSCOOPER · Post by **POOPERSCOOPER** » Sat May 14, 2005 4:30 am

I take fallout 1/2 series as already dead, having Bethesda come in and make a FO3 that attempts to be like those games is just a plus. Even if theres a good chance the game will suck, atleast someone is making an effort to try and make a game like Fallout.

Blargh · Post by **Blargh** » Sat May 14, 2005 4:54 am

Haris wrote:As long as they leave out mutant prostitutes /EL SNIPPO HAS RETURNED ! AHAHAA !!1

Bigot.

Thoth · Post by **Thoth** » Sat May 14, 2005 11:31 pm

where right from the start, you can meander over to the Military Base and give 'em hell. Then waltz down to the Cathedral and give them hell too. Of course, you'd die horribly because you're only a level 1 but there were no limits preventing you from finishing the game when you were ready.

The same exact thing happens in Morrowind. You can waltz over to Dagoth Ur, grabbing Sunder and Keening along the way (kind of like how the designers of F1/F2 put towns between you and a destination) and fight him. Sure, you'd die... but you'd die the same way if you fought the Master.

Even if you kill the Voodoo God floating in his temple, you get a useless trinket and the "You fucked the game up!" message.

...

That "useless trinket" is the same item you get if you progress through the entirely optional main quest.

Screaming_Dude_in_Vegas · Sun May 15, 2005 5:52 am

DarkUnderlord wrote:
Screaming_Dude_in_Vegas wrote:Also, at least morrowind wasn't liniar. I mean aside from fallout, it is the only RPG that is truely open ended. Not as in "Multiple endings", but as in, you go anwhere, do anything. At least bethsada has expeirience with this type of game.
Hey, woah there! Don't confuse "open-ended" with "non-linearity". They're two different kettles full of two different types of fish. Morrowind was as linear as hell. You HAD to do the XYZ before you got the ABC and then talk to JFK before you could approach NOP and so on, right through the entire main quest.

If you walked into the Bad Dudes Lair before you'd done all of that, you got a voice saying "D00d WTF, UR not rdy!!1!". Compared to Fallout where right from the start, you can meander over to the Military Base and give 'em hell. Then waltz down to the Cathedral and give them hell too. Of course, you'd die horribly because you're only a level 1 but there were no limits preventing you from finishing the game when you were ready. The only reason you followed the main plot was because that's the only way to find things out for the first time. I've often played a game of Fallout where I simply stumbled into one ending or another because I didn't want to go through the main quest "by the book" again.

Compare that to Morrowind where you have to go through the hocus pocus to be named Neveravine (even forcing you to do slavery and what-not in their badly designed non-multiple solution quests), then talking to that God d00d, then trying to remember who you sold that ph4t hammer too because you thought it was cursed but nooo... it's a significant part of the plot. Even if you kill the Voodoo God floating in his temple, you get a useless trinket and the "You fucked the game up!" message.

Though admittedly, if you knew of it, there was a guy in some place or another you could talk to whereby you could actually finish the game. If you knew about that, that is. Mostly when I got that message, I reloaded. God Forbid I get stuck in a game that never ends.

The main quest WASN'T the main point of morrowind. If somone plays morrowind primarely for the main quest, then they've got the whole Idea all wrong. And as somone else posted, you could go strait to the end of the MQ.

Morrowind (In my mind) was very much like fallout in that you missed so much if you whent strait for the main quest. I liked both games because they kinda keep everything fresh with tons of "sidequests" which actually become the coolest part of the game.

Granted, fallout did this ALOT better than morrowind, because, as I said earlier, they were going from almost completely randomly generated worlds into a completely hand-crafted one, and felt like they needed to pack as much content in as possible. The result was an abundace of "Run and bring me this item" quests. Oblivion seems like it will be more like Fallout, with "only" 50 or so quests, but they'll actually be cool and such (as aposed to morrowind which had like 300 quests, but I'd realy only want to play 15-30 of them), so I think it's a sign that FO3 won't suck. It may not be as good as the originals, it might be as good but diferent, which will throw some people off, but I don't think it will be outright bad.