All Our Base Are Belong to China!

[Redeye]

The ever-present stupidity of the human beings never ceases to amaze me... Nobody has enough trust in the other to completely destroy their nuclear weapons...

Woo! Wooo! Here comes the moron train! Far be it from us to trust without reservation the nation that, in 1950, attacked an American led UN peacekeeping force (ie: the Americans) without provocation. I could also discuss their efforts in both Indochinese wars, but hey, WHERE THE FUCK IS INDOCHINA? KEKEKEKEKEKEKE

And I'd have to agree here on Aonaran's point; assuming an invasion force somehow manages to get to the United States, all those privately owned firearms foreigners constantly bitch about are going to make pacification a real pain in the ass.

I doubt most Americans are actually proficient with their weapons.
Then there is the matter of employing them in an organized fashion.
Simply isolate the food and water supplies. Disable the utilities.
Some good guerillas would emerge, but most of the "armed populace" would be dead bubbas.
Maybe... maybe not.
Perhaps the enemy is within. Ever notice all those shady white people all over the place and nobody even notices them? I wonder what those caspers are up to. Plotting something? Driving around in their SUVs, walking around in their suits and casual clothes. Y'know... putting on this whole milquetoast pedestrian act.
We gotta watch them crazy white devils.
word

[DarkUnderlord]

And I'd have to agree here on Aonaran's point; assuming an invasion force somehow manages to get to the United States, all those privately owned firearms foreigners constantly bitch about are going to make pacification a real pain in the ass.

Not really. Carpet bombing "places of resistance" isn't all that hard. I doubt a hostile invasion army - which is going to have to use nukes anyway - is going to care enough about a place to fight street to street. It's much easier to drop bombs on them from great heights.

So unless America allows the right to bear nuclear missiles, then your Hill Billies are pretty much just as screwed as your army. Besides, if an invasion force manages to get past the army TO the hill billies, I doubt a ragtag group of poorly trained idiots with too many guns than they can handle is going to present much of a problem to something even like... Ohhh say, a TANK.

[vx trauma]

A lot of guns doesn't equal hard to conquer territory. You also need tactics, cordination, leadership, training,
skill and discipline. And most of all, the WILL to sacrifice everything for the cause - whatsoever. Weekend rambos drooling how we are invincible with our shit here are just pathetic.

[Urizen]

PS, far as pollution goes, we have fewer emmitions than most other countries because of our regulations on clean air & such... Most of your 2nd and 3rd world countries are just as responsible, if not more so.

That's just not right. The US is the worlds worst polluter per capita.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/env ... ue_200_cap

The talk of the town here in the EU is the Kyoto accord, which Bush has declined to sign. Also, many feel that 2nd and 3rd world countries have the right to pollute a bit, thinking that that's an unfortunate but necessary part of their development. Very few people feel that the US still needs that development.

[johnnygothisgun]

I still submit that pacification of the United States would not be a simple task. Do you think the average Viet Minh or Cong was a master with his weapon? However, did he (or she) still manage to wreak havoc on morale, even to a point where both the French and the United States were forced to pull out? Was the same not true in Afghanistan, both in 1980 and, to a lesser extent, today? This "will to sacrifice everything" is a complete theatrical lie - it's what sends a group of people down the path of failure, not eventual victory. Also, on an enemy neutralizing the hillbillie's ability to fight back by way of carpet bombing - if your intent is to occupy, running arc light fun fests beforehand is a real big no-no. If the aim is to discourage any kind of armed action by the population, American, or whoever, carpet bombing them beforehand is a really good way to kick their teetering ass straight over the fence and start them thinking about establishing new, hurtful welcome committees.

[Blargh]

I say get on with it.

Personally, I'm itching to see more genocide. A taste for claret never really leaves, and this planet would be infinitely better served without humans. Be gracious guests, don't weary your welcome much further.

[Aneurysm]

Where's Kashluk when you need him...

[ApTyp]

Most of you probably don't realize it, but today's American gun owner is, for the first time, outgunned by more efficient and more modern firearms the government has. Before the manufacture ban on machineguns, and restrictions on destructive devices, you could own anything the Army had, and probably some better stuff the Army didn't (there were certainly better assault rifles than M16).

But now, it's pretty much pointless. All of privately owned machineguns, rocket launchers, mortars, tanks, and helicopters are getting old, obsolete, and weared from use. And most people care more about their salaries than personal safety.

[Urizen]

Caring for your personal safety is the best reason not to own a gun. Firearms kill a helluva lot more curious children and careless adults than they kill criminals.

EDIT 9\9\05: Oops, not correct. Found a lot of stats to support the above statement, but they all seem to be based on crappy science. All hail the mighy Aptyp.

[S4ur0n27]

Fanatism....

[ApTyp]

Caring for your personal safety is the best reason not to own a gun. Firearms kill a helluva lot more curious children and careless adults than they kill criminals.

Data for unintentional firearm-related deaths in 2002:

Age Group / Number of Deaths / Population / Crude Rate

Code: Select all

00-04 	12* 	19,575,536 	0.06*
05-09 	14* 	19,960,444 	0.07*
10-14 	34 	21,093,745 	0.16
15-19 	107 	20,347,666 	0.53
20-24 	103 	20,329,966 	0.51
25-29 	75 	18,901,904 	0.40
30-34 	68 	20,812,587 	0.33
35-39 	52 	21,805,533 	0.24
40-44 	71 	22,941,937 	0.31
45-49 	52 	21,264,091 	0.24
50-54 	43 	18,764,692 	0.23
55-59 	36 	14,972,666 	0.24
60-64 	20* 	11,595,687 	0.17*
65-69 	17* 	9,585,105 	0.18*
70-74 	19* 	8,708,218 	0.22*
75-79 	18* 	7,433,706 	0.24*
80-84 	14* 	5,310,113 	0.26*
85+ 	7* 	4,570,405 	0.15*

Total 	762 	287,974,001 	0.26

* Rates based on 20 or fewer deaths may be unstable. Use with caution.

I'm not a big fan of statistics, because they are often misleading unless you know how to read them (and when you do, they tell you far less information than you really need), but I would say that for a country of 288 million people, 762 deaths is nothing. If anything, 11,829 homicides with a gun is more than enough incentive to own one yourself.

[S4ur0n27]

I dunno, but once you got shot dead, having a gun or not won't change much.

[ApTyp]

Yes, but not having a gun is even worse. I always fasten my seat belt even though it stops being effective after a pretty low speed limit.

[Cimmerian Nights]

I think a quick re-viewing of Red Dawn would put this argument to rest.

I only hope that Patrick Swayze is still alive to lead us when the dink hordes arrive.

[Kashluk]

Yes, but not having a gun is even worse. I always fasten my seat belt even though it stops being effective after a pretty low speed limit.

With the exception that people putting on their seat belts doesn't increase the risk of you being hit by them. ( If we really need an auto-mobile related example, you could compare it to the size of your car: the heavier your vehicle is, the less likely you are to get hurt in a crash and the more likely the unfortunate fellows who crash into you are going to get hurt. )

[johnnygothisgun]

I say get on with it.

Personally, I'm itching to see more genocide. A taste for claret never really leaves, and this planet would be infinitely better served without humans. Be gracious guests, don't weary your welcome much further.

You must forgive my asking, but did you mean "claret" as in a reference to the British raids in Indonesia?

[Aonaran]

Caring for your personal safety is the best reason not to own a gun. Firearms kill a helluva lot more curious children and careless adults than they kill criminals.

Yeah, i'd say it's the irrisponsible parents killing the children, not the guns. Irrisponsible people never run short of ways to kill themselves or the people around them. I believe in gun ownership but I also believe in responsibility. I don't think the prior should exist without the latter.

That shit reminds me of parents who bitch about violence and sex on tv. Those people are full of shit because if they were parents halfway worth a fuck they would parent their children. However they do not, they just put their kids in front of the set to pacify them so they don't have to be parents, then bitch when the programs on tv (not intended for their children to begin with) don't make good stand in mother and father figures.

[Nicolai]

Firearms kill a helluva lot more curious children and careless adults than they kill criminals.

Where's the catch?

[Europa13]

We have a right to bare arms, to defend ourselves and to defend against a tryannical governing body... We have the right to overthrow our own government. That is why we have the right to bare arms... And yes, it makes it hard for a foreign government to invade. And do you really think that 90% of the people with guns, after an invasion, would lack leadership? How many Special and Delta Forces soldiers (keep in mind the SEALS, Pararescue, Rangers, etc...) have passed through the Army since say... The 1970s? What do you think they'd be doing? And what was their job? To train foreign soldiers, well, at least SF... Delta... hehe, KILL KILL KILL. Then, look at how many reserve officers from the Army and other branches there are, local police, etc... You have quite a number of possible leaders in any given city. Also, thanks to Bush, the assault weapons ban was lifted... Lately i've been thinking about getting the new HK-XM8 myself with a Sig P226 9mm as a sidearm... Good all around coverage. The point is, you'd have a lot more "well ogranized" groups than you might think... And again, as I said earlier, the big ones you have to worry about are the Neo Nazis and KKK because they're already organized and will be afterwards, not to mention that most of them live in rural areas any ways and wouldn't be killed by the bombs right off probably. ;0) And then someone mentioned that you're more likely to get hurt if you own a gun? Shit happens... Hell, i'm more likely to run someone over, kill my child while he's riding with me in a car, die in a plane crash, or god knows what else than have someone shoot themselves with my gun, but do I give up driving (Side Note: I'm all for advancements in gun saftey, smart chips, etc..)? That whole train of thought is bullshit and .... Grrrrr... If you're scared of guns, don't own one... Don't try to take my rights away because you're a pussy... And I'm not saying you *whoever made that comment* are, but there are a lot who have that same idea and want to see the 2nd taken away from us legal gun owners.

[ApTyp]

XM8? As in the new plastic rifle of the US Army? Wasn't it scrapped due to serious heat tolerance issues?