Pentagon doesn't know what else to do with their nukes

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Kashluk

Post by Kashluk »

King of Creation wrote:There is no way the United States could lose a war that it devoted its full attention to. Which is something that must happen in Iran. And then North Korea. And then Sudan, and so on until democratic governments are set up in every single state in the world. There's no point in arguing with this, because all opposition to this viewpoint is baseless. Go ahead...try it.
I'd rather see it done by a nation that's truly equal and democratic, instead of a country where people can't vote directly at their own candidate, where social welfare and helthcare systems make DDR look like a shining example of prosperity and where one man has enough power for the system to be considered anything but not a democracy (guess where Hitler came up with the idea of uniting the seats of prime minister/head of government and chancellor/head of state?). Come to think of it, I don't want to see it at all. Forced into a mold by an invading force, that is. If there should be change, it should happen from the inside supported from the outside, of course, but never ending up in a situation where outsiders come and begin dictating.
King of Neocon wrote:not lose, not lose, not lose, not lose
Define "lose". To be exterminated? To be beaten down to a substantially lower level than in the beginning? To give up? Saying "US will not lose" might be true if we consider "losing" to be something like complete occupation of American territory or the death of the last American citizen, but there are many, many other ways to get your ass kicked. One hurricane can cut deep in the American flesh, so now let's think all theoretically and chit - what would an attack from the rest of the world cause? 6 200 000 000 versus 280 000 000, that's over 22 times more. USA is not self-sufficient; America needs the rest of the world at least as much as the rest of the world needs her. If only the oil-tap was closed it'd cause a major crisis, not to mention the abolishment of all current trade agreements, the closing of borders etc.
I'm pursuing a doctorate in political science
Well good luck on that one. I bet the project's going to move a heap forward once you finish high school :dance:
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Post by CrazyNick »

Okay, I've read a lot of stupid shit in this topic. I'll list them

1) Enough nukes to destroy the world 5 TIMES OVER

2) Most countires don't have more than a dozen hydrogen bombs, why you ask, they are expensive to make and maintian, and nukes are cheaper

3) In a nuclear war we all lose. It doesn't matter who makes the first strike, Russia, China, N. Korea, And USA have almost a quarter of their nukes on subs. The retalotry strike would wipe out any surviving countries.

4) Nuclear winter. Well you survived the atomic blasts, the radiation. Now all you have to contend with is a few HUNDRED years of atomic winter in which all plant and animal life is destroyed. Have fun surviving without food or air. Ph and the dust from the blasts would cover the skies so you get no sunlight either

5) Their are no "clean" bombs. To make them more effective they cause more destruction and emit more radiation. Thats the point of a nuke. As many people died from the radiation left in Haroshima as from the actual blast

in conclusion America is being a giant fucking retard for allowing this shit to slide. nuclear weapons are not the answer. WE ALL LOSE IN THE END WITH A NUCLEAR WAR. Thank you for your
opinions.

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Post by ApTyp »

Do you realize how little sense you made in your last post?
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Post by CrazyNick »

nope. Just that the point i'm trying to make is that America is being a giant dumbass for allowing preemptive nuke strikes. And that if a nuke war was to happen. The world gets blown to apsolute shit
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Post by ApTyp »

What do you care? You live in fucking Canada for god sakes.
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Post by A_M »

CrazyNick wrote:nope. Just that the point i'm trying to make is that America is being a giant dumbass for allowing preemptive nuke strikes. And that if a nuke war was to happen. The world gets blown to apsolute shit
It's all about a race in war technology. Nothing to be excited about man.
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Post by ApTyp »

Nuke angst is a new rage in the late 00's? :drunk:
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Post by A_M »

ApTyp wrote:Nuke angst is a new rage in the late 00's? :drunk:
The topic shows it is :drunk:
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Post by ApTyp »

Yeah, I was surprised how quickly it grew to three pages.
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Post by A_M »

ApTyp wrote:Yeah, I was surprised how quickly it grew to three pages.
And it's only the begining :evil_laugh:
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Post by ApTyp »

Are you going to flood this thread with spam, too? D:
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Post by A_M »

ApTyp wrote:Are you going to flood this thread with spam, too? D:
Sure :drunk:
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Post by ApTyp »

You'll just get asshat'ed, congoid.
With that, I conclude this pointless exchange.
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Post by A_M »

ApTyp wrote:You'll just get asshat'ed, congoid.
With that, I conclude this pointless exchange.
If it's like that, than i pass :drunk:
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Post by King of Creation »

CrazyNick wrote: 3) In a nuclear war we all lose. It doesn't matter who makes the first strike, Russia, China, N. Korea, And USA have almost a quarter of their nukes on subs. The retalotry strike would wipe out any surviving countries.
Not true. Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) went out with the cold war.

5) Their are no "clean" bombs. To make them more effective they cause more destruction and emit more radiation. Thats the point of a nuke. As many people died from the radiation left in Haroshima as from the actual blast
Hydrogen bombs are, in fact, "clean" bombs. They emit very little radiation, but with a blast far greater than that of the conventional nuke.
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Post by King of Creation »

Kashluk wrote:I'd rather see it done by a nation that's truly equal and democratic, instead of a country where people can't vote directly at their own candidate, where social welfare and helthcare systems make DDR look like a shining example of prosperity and where one man has enough power for the system to be considered anything but not a democracy (guess where Hitler came up with the idea of uniting the seats of prime minister/head of government and chancellor/head of state?). Come to think of it, I don't want to see it at all. Forced into a mold by an invading force, that is. If there should be change, it should happen from the inside supported from the outside, of course, but never ending up in a situation where outsiders come and begin dictating.
True democracies don't work. It's called mob rule. We everyone of our own officials. The electoral college is just another way of voting. We elect the electors, and the electors elect based on our votes. It's a much more fair system than pure election by popular vote because the president has to cater to every state and area, not just the areas with the big population. It forces issues.

And the executive branch does not have more power than any of the other two branches of government. I don't need to give a basic US civics lesson.
Define "lose".
To lose, in this context, would be either complete destruction or bowing down to another state.
One hurricane can cut deep in the American flesh
Not in terms of logistics, it didn't. Moral fiber maybe, but not anything that can't be rebuilt, or anything that can detrimentally harm the US.
so now let's think all theoretically and chit - what would an attack from the rest of the world cause? 6 200 000 000 versus 280 000 000, that's over 22 times more.
Manpower doesn't matter. What matters is the fact that the US spends more money on the military than any other state in the world. In fact, the US spends almost $650 billion on its military(http://www.warresisters.org/piechart.htm note that this figure includes the US military budget, plus the budgets for the current conflicts). The rest of the world, combined, only spends about $500 billion (http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... ending.htm). The US spends more than every one else IN THE WORLD COMBINED. Not to mention the fact that the US is in the most geographically strategic position in the world. Getting troops in the mainland US would be virtually impossible, especially considering that the security dilemma that would pre-exist before a US vs World war would mean the US would drastically upgrade the defensive capabilities of mainland US.
USA is not self-sufficient
Actually, we're the most self sufficient state in the world. We have the natural resources to fully sustain the entire US population comfortably.
If only the oil-tap was closed it'd cause a major crisis, not to mention the abolishment of all current trade agreements, the closing of borders etc.
I'm not sure what you mean here. Do you mean that if the rest of the world stopped trading oil to the US?
I'm pursuing a doctorate in political science
Well good luck on that one. I bet the project's going to move a heap forward once you finish high school :dance:
[/quote]

I'm glad to see that my knowledge is being appreciated in such a manner. Please go and take some higher education courses or something. Enlighten yourself to the facts. Do some research. Compare numbers. Otherwise, you'll just continue to sound ignorant.
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Kashluk

Post by Kashluk »

Well gee, someone's sure touchy. This whole administrator issue's grown a bubble in your temple or something?

You have a right for your opinion, I have for mine. Basically I think yours suck and you think mine does the same. So we're done, ok josé? Just because you think big of yourself doesn't make your opinions - and let's face it, in the end they are just opinions, hypothetical assumptions of things and situations that do not exist - any better than anyone elses.
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Post by St. Toxic »

Democracy can never win a war. Its' people care for the little things. A worthless method of governing, where both the loss and win equal a loss. The weapon matters not, its how you use it. You throw a rock at monsters, while begging for forgiveness, while they aim at your children, and laugh a hearly laugh. Both sides loose a pawn, but only one is hurt by it. The democratic side.

Thank you.
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Post by Franz Schubert »

KoC wrote:I am not of the same political affiliations as George Bush. If I can be classified as anything, it's probably a Neocon.
Is this a joke? Let me guess: you think Bush is a Moderate Conservative.
KoC wrote:LISTEN TO WOLFOWITZ NEXT TIME.
Listening to that scumbag's lies is what led us into Iraq in the first place.
KoC wrote:must happen in Iran. And then North Korea. And then Sudan, and so on until democratic governments are set up in every single state in the world.
Another joke? Democratic governments? You mean puppet governments controlled by the U.S. And there's no excuse for that kind of imperialism.
KoC wrote:Iraq and Vietnam were mistakes. They were mistakes because we didn't devote enough resources.
They were mistakes because people like you think the U.S. can solve all it's problems by bombing them away.
johnnygothisgun wrote:Christ, only a handful of the many, many boomer subs the US has got all around the world would have enough munitions to turn the planet into a big, molten ball.
I'm horrified that people take comfort in this fact. How can you boast about something like that? Are you even thinking about what you're saying?
KoC wrote:The neocon theory involves going into every state throughout the world and setting up free, democratic societies
That is Bush's fucking theory (minus the free, democratic part). I assume you've never read the PNAC document. Apparently you also don't understand the Checks and Balances concept. Bush has to go through congress each time he wants to start a war, and he's worried congress isn't going to fall for the same lies twice. That's the only reason he's only gotten as far as Iraq. Saying Bush is not a neocon is just ignorant.
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Post by Ranger »

Yes, I was refering to AA and AS missles. And Yes I was refering to the fact that a lot of our jobs were outsourced. However, I realize that the M16, the M1 and almost all of our weapons are still produced here, but in limited numbers. The reason we were able to win WW2 was because of all the production facilities here. We were able to turn car factories into tank plants, textile mills into uniform factories, chemical plants into munitions works, and so on and so on, but we still have the problem that most of THOSE jobs have been outsourced. And as far as the best technology? The Nazis had the best tech, best trained troops, best scientists ect. But they still lost a war with the world. And that was only 2\3rds of it. They had the problem of not having enough people, not having enough factories, ect. I know that wars now are fought differently than ww2, but it still sets a historical pressident. And as far as we could fight the war and not lose? Hell man, everyone would lose.
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