The French find yet ANOTHER low .........

johnnygothisgun · Post by **johnnygothisgun** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:36 am

philowar wrote:You come across as a really bright, well-spoken guy.

philowar wrote:First off, second-hand smoke is a crock of shit. It's junk science.
"If you were to be strapped down on a surgical table while four guys exhaled smoke directly into your mouth and nostrils for thirty years, you might get lung cancer forty years after they stopped--but it's not likely."

Furthermore, I can't believe someone who presents himself as so young and hip and a fan of a post apocalypse RPG on top of that could be on the Purtian, uptight, life-affirming, anti-smoking bandwagon. Do you make sure your diet is high in fiber too? Are you enjoying your light and healthy lifestyle?

atoga · Post by **atoga** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:47 am

philowar wrote:
johnnygothisgun wrote:are you some kind of fucking retard? it smells terrible, youre a fucking retard
People fucking smell and are hazardous to my health. I wish they could be banned too. Hey, your mouth smells pretty bad for that matter. Nice language. You come across as a really bright, well-spoken guy.

you totally ignored my post

johnnygothisgun · Post by **johnnygothisgun** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:50 am

but that would have hurt his argument

Blargh · Post by **Blargh** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 10:06 am

Eventually humanity will be briefly united through Radium 226 dusted tooth paste. No one will bother arguing about second hand smoke then.

Trust me.

In the interim, try to not worry quite so much.

Superhaze · Post by **Superhaze** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 7:20 pm

There is NO WAY second hand smoking is harmful
to people who do not activly engage in it (dont
know who would do that, but thats another story).
All second hand smoking kills research has been
bought by the anti-smoking groups, and the
reasearch that all of the big anti-smoking groups
use as fact has been thrown out by a US federal
court because it was obvious that they removed all
information that did not fit their planned outcome.
IE. they cheated, lied, and earned big fucking bucks
making everyone panick about bullshit cancer risks.

Long live paranoia!
Obey propaganda!

Shitty-edit: Only proves one thing.. whining allways works.
fucking whiny little bitches who cant just tell a smoker to fuck off if he is
annoying them. What is wrong with allways having to have goddamn laws
to make ordinairy things like manners and politeness mandatory.
As to finding info about this it takes about 2 minutes and google.

Link: http://www.heartland.org/Article.cfm?artid=13833
A little snippet form another article:
"It now turns out that the influential 1993 EPA report "Respiratory Health Effects of Passive Smoking: Lung Cancer and Other Disorders" was as phony as a three-dollar bill. State officials and private businesses that believed that ETS was a public health danger (and not just a nuisance) were completely misled by the EPA. And, of course, so was main street American public opinion."

Lots more where that came from...

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 7:27 pm

Superhaze wrote:Shitty-edit: Only proves one thing.. whining allways works.
fucking whiny little bitches who cant just tell a smoker to fuck off if he is
annoying them. What is wrong with allways having to have goddamn laws
to make ordinairy things like manners and politeness mandatory.

Agreed.

If I was smoking, smeone asked me to fuck off cause it annoied em or whatever I would, simply out of courtesy.

A great example I saw of the whole mindset of these folks one time was on some TV show, froget which one, the host took out a cigar, unlit, and someone in the audiance started choughing very loudly.

A: it was unlit

B: even if he lit it up. the fumes that make someone chough would take a little bit of time to get to the person.

This is simply a symbtom of the larger problem of junk science.

Someone belives something is a certain way, they have research done, and done so no matter what their belief is proven.

Thor Kaufman · Post by **Thor Kaufman** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 9:30 pm

atoga wrote:much as i'm pro-destroying my own body, i have to agree with johnny. also, as i see it the onus is on you guys to somehow prove that nonsmokers should have to put up with that shit, not the other way around, and so far you have done nothing but provide vaguely insulting nonarguments. uhh? sounds like typical elitist asshole smoker mentality from here

also, since when is the notion that second hand smoke is harmful considered junk science? link? expand, elaborate, elucidate, extramarital, echo and the bunnymen

I concur. Passive smoking may not be as harmful as active smoking, still it is harmful.
Also, the cigarette ingredients, agents and whatnot tend to glue to walls and all kinds of stuff they come in contact with, subsequently dissolving again, so it's not just an acute matter of lighting a cigarette, cigarettes tend to "radiate"

the insides of closed containers with their stuff.

Fun fact: some isotop (forgot which) tends to stick to tobacco plants

Megatron · Post by **Megatron** » Sat Feb 10, 2007 11:35 pm

jeez, you probably get more fucked up off eating fucking mcdonalds or driving a car than breathing in a little tobacco smoke. wheres your fucking patriotism at, all stand around like limp dicked dickheads not sniffing a alchohol drip or a drop of smoke. smoking is nice.

Thor Kaufman · Post by **Thor Kaufman** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 12:08 am

I tend to evaluate drugs by their effects, not their perceived value or supposed "coolness" factor, cigarettes just don't do it for me. Also, kissing smokers is quite horrible.

Megatron · Post by **Megatron** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 12:17 am

i dont really care about any of that shit. its just nice to wake up in the morning, cough a few timea nd have a cig. guess if i werre alchoholic itd be like that first beer. first hit in the day to keep yo u rolling? not about being cool or what people see. its just, a smoke. its like food or water. its only effect is to talk to other smokers and keep you not smoking for another hour or so

T-900 · Post by **T-900** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 1:55 am

All that surprises me still is that governments still take addicts seriously.

How can a nicotine addict be taken seriously? The primary argument in favour of smoking is that, essentially, people want to smoke.

But people only want to smoke because the addiction compels them to continue smoking to hold back the negative effects of stress o.O

... Why isn't smoking completely outlawed, in the same was as murder, and raping babies? I couldn't respect the opinion of a chemical addict any more than I could the opinion of a murderous paedophile. They're both doing something illogical and harmful for no reason they can intelligently support

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 1:58 am

Cigarates kept me (and many other soldiers) from shooting incompitent and or asshat officers in Iraq.

johnnygothisgun · Post by **johnnygothisgun** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 2:06 am

if you need to smoke in order to remain calm enough not to shoot someone, i dont really think you should be in the army?

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 2:10 am

It's a common thing.

Stress relief.

Lysandus · Post by **Lysandus** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:07 am

Smoking or shooting people?

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:09 am

Both.

jetbaby · Post by **jetbaby** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 4:12 am

Washington state (that would be the north-westernmost state of the continental United States, to you filthy communist foreigners) last year passed a law (year before?) that bans smoking inside every public building (a term which encompasses everything that is not a private residence) as well as within 25 feet of an entrance to said building. Businesses are not given an option to allow smoking and the fine is $100.

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 4:17 am

Said state also contains the city that has the highest suicide rate in the US.

Tingel Tangel · Post by **Tingel Tangel** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 4:43 am

Thor Kaufman wrote: Also, kissing smokers is quite horrible.

Aww, there goes my chance

atoga · Post by **atoga** » Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:36 am

PsychoSniper wrote:Said state also contains the city that has the highest suicide rate in the US.

that's relevant how? why are you not asshatted yet?

while megatron is right that smoking is a healthy habit that patriots can take part in and enjoy (though it is ruined by dependence, so it must be done in moderation), it is the case with all forms of drug reform that, ideally, the role of government should be to guarantee individuals as much autonomy they want in partaking, or not partaking. the kicker is, of course, that people should be given the right to a clean environment, relatively free of the hazardous side effects that come about as a result of users using.

no matter how you cut it, secondhand smoke is at least slightly hazardous; i don't see why reasonably minded people would dispute this.

the rest should be pretty self evident, unless somewhere down the line you believe that governments shouldn't have a fun-dÃƒÂ¤-mental role in guaranteeing people autonomy? what's more i don't see why "practical"

type arguments like 'by gum i really like my smokes society will go totally haywire if da government cracks down on me smoking them in public' have any place in this kind of debate.

uhhh.

also ridiculous:

T-900 wrote:Why isn't smoking completely outlawed, in the same was as murder, and raping babies? I couldn't respect the opinion of a chemical addict any more than I could the opinion of a murderous paedophile. They're both doing something illogical and harmful for no reason they can intelligently support

anyway start flaming me please