Hope?

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 2:50 am

They had an iso option ?

I thought it was just 3rd person with zoom ?

Brother None · Post by **Brother None** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:24 am

PsychoSniper wrote:They had an iso option ?

I thought it was just 3rd person with zoom ?

It's a bloody moveable camera that can be put at whatever angle and at whatever zoom you bloody well want

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:25 am

so its 1st/3rd person zoom / rotatable.

TelemachusSneezed · Post by **TelemachusSneezed** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:17 pm

Kharn wrote:It's a bloody moveable camera that can be put at whatever angle and at whatever zoom you bloody well want

Actually, since Bethsoft is going to go all high-tech on us anyways, I would not mind such a thing. It's better than a fixed 1st-person view, and perhaps even better than the iso-whatever (too lazy to look it up right now) perspective that I know people have been railing for. I'd be nice if Bethsoft went ahead and threw an option in to keep the game in iso-whatever perspective throughout the entire game. It'd be a quick feature they could probably throw in towards the end.

The only thing I'm not sure I can live without is the "pointy-clicky" way of moving. How does one even determine AP for movement under a continuous movement paradigm, anyways? Isn't AP for movement during combat a prerequisite for RPG games?

PsychoSniper · Post by **PsychoSniper** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:22 pm

Yeah, and during non combat it doesnt matter.

Diring combat, the hex movement icon shows a number, the umber of APs it'd cost to move that far.

TelemachusSneezed · Post by **TelemachusSneezed** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:32 pm

That's what I'm saying, Psycho. How does one do AP movement during combat in first person perspective? Sounds a bit akward; even in Anachronox they had to change the camera view during combat.

atoga · Post by **atoga** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:16 pm

TelemachusSneezed wrote:That's what I'm saying, Psycho. How does one do AP movement during combat in first person perspective? Sounds a bit akward; even in Anachronox they had to change the camera view during combat.

you can't, but

i always thought the AP system as it was done in fallout was slightly ridiculous, and

no tabletop rpgs have an AP system at all like that. in fact, most tabletop rpg systems don't use APs at all (only GURPS does, and it doesn't make silly restrictions like keeping you from firing a weapon while moving around).

no reason to implement it as it was 10 years ago. :anachronism:

TelemachusSneezed · Post by **TelemachusSneezed** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 11:16 pm

Fair enough. What takes its place, however? One can't perpetually move during combat.

Brother None · Post by **Brother None** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 11:43 pm

atoga wrote:only GURPS does, and it doesn't make silly restrictions like keeping you from firing a weapon while moving around

We'd like to think the computer version will be as close as
you can get to playing GURPS, short of playing GURPS. We're playing close
attention to combat and injury rules - Tim Cain

atoga · Post by **atoga** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 3:13 am

have you actually played gurps, kharn? the injury & shooting rules in fallout are vaguely reminiscent of gurps. nothing else is, especially not the whole acting in combat thing (turn order is done quite differently too). gurps combat is meant to be as realistic as possible, whereas fallout's combat has a lot more in common with games like d20 modern. go read up on it if you must.

TelemachusSneezed wrote:One can't perpetually move during combat.

why not? it would be reasonable for a player to get massive penalties for perpetually moving around but i don't see why the rules should go out of their way to prevent this.

Brother None · Post by **Brother None** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 1:12 pm

atoga wrote:have you actually played gurps, kharn? the injury & shooting rules in fallout are vaguely reminiscent of gurps. nothing else is, especially not the whole acting in combat thing (turn order is done quite differently too). gurps combat is meant to be as realistic as possible, whereas fallout's combat has a lot more in common with games like d20 modern. go read up on it if you must.

I musn't. The contention that Fallout was technically too limited to duplicate GURPs "simultaneous movement"-assets it probably fair.

Saying it's silly Fallout has action points is silly, though.

Also, I was just quoting the creator of Fallout, y'know, not giving my own opinion.

Thor Kaufman · Post by **Thor Kaufman** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 1:29 pm

I don't see why APs are a silly thing, either. If one is more agile and flexible, one can do more stuff faster, sounds quite reasonable.

Brother None · Post by **Brother None** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 1:52 pm

Thor Kaufman wrote:I don't see why APs are a silly thing, either. If one is more agile and flexible, one can do more stuff faster, sounds quite reasonable.

its not relistic it riuns immershunlol

TelemachusSneezed · Post by **TelemachusSneezed** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 5:47 pm

atoga wrote:why not? it would be reasonable for a player to get massive penalties for perpetually moving around but i don't see why the rules should go out of their way to prevent this.

GURPS rules don't "go out of their way" to prevent movement. The use of AP limits during combat simply force the player to choose their actions carefully as one would need to under a real combat situation (I guess, I'm a pussy and I've never even gotten into a real fight).

So you agree that movement should be limited during combat. Then how? By your arguments, AP movement during combat isn't a good enough regulator, so what's the alternative?