Sept. 11 and the War on Terror: Bullshit or Patriotism?

[Dark Xenomorph]

What is this map you speak of?

[Megatron]

the one that you look at to get around? And the locals probably speak the same as the other locals and don't take pictures of everything.

[Follower]

Guardian - I know that Stalin was old crasy freak, but he was the best, our country could handle. I don't think that he looked nice. My grandma told me that he was short, freckled and weak... And one more thing. May be he was sadist, but he made a lot of good for a world - put America on it's place with their blasted nuckes, destroyed Hitler with his ambitions... created Israel, by the way... If I remember right, Stalin was the one of these, who wanted to do it. Everybody else were against it, because they thought that it would be another communistic country... Anyway, after all these problems I even don't think that it was so good for jews...

Dark Xenomorph - this city is called actually St. Petersburg. Well, he was renamed so many times, that I even don't know for sure. This town is surely beatiful, I think that I'll visit it someday. Do you know that this city is called "criminal capital" of the Russia? Well, to tell the truth this town is peaceful, but tuorists with money are welcomed everywhere... and by everybody. Believe me, your father is lucky that he left the metro with his pants. Tourists are like a honey for a beer for all sorts of criminals... As I know this is a problem in a whole world... So, nevermind... this is unpleasant, but think about it as another advanture.

St. Petersburg is one of the most young cities of the Russia, by the way. It was founded only in 18 centery. Canada is young country, but there are towns there much older, than it. Old indian settlements, towns, founded by indians themselfs... You can't say that Canada is 200 years old. It had another name, by it existed much later. There were only single tribes, but it changes nothing. Europeans came there not so long time ago... Damn, why am I telling you about it? You know it already without me.

[the guardian]

he didnt create israel, but you russians definitly contributed for its existence, thats for sure

[Section8]

I'm waiting for the US to start bombing Northern Ireland. "Hey there's 'terrorists' in there somewhere so let's just bomb the whole fucking country!"

[Constipated BladeRunner]

Guardian - I know that Stalin was old crasy freak, but he was the best, our country could handle. I don't think that he looked nice. My grandma told me that he was short, freckled and weak... And one more thing. May be he was sadist, but he made a lot of good for a world - put America on it's place with their blasted nuckes, destroyed Hitler with his ambitions... created Israel, by the way... If I remember right, Stalin was the one of these, who wanted to do it. Everybody else were against it, because they thought that it would be another communistic country... Anyway, after all these problems I even don't think that it was so good for jews...

Dark Xenomorph - this city is called actually St. Petersburg. Well, he was renamed so many times, that I even don't know for sure. This town is surely beatiful, I think that I'll visit it someday. Do you know that this city is called "criminal capital" of the Russia? Well, to tell the truth this town is peaceful, but tuorists with money are welcomed everywhere... and by everybody. Believe me, your father is lucky that he left the metro with his pants. Tourists are like a honey for a beer for all sorts of criminals... As I know this is a problem in a whole world... So, nevermind... this is unpleasant, but think about it as another advanture.

St. Petersburg is one of the most young cities of the Russia, by the way. It was founded only in 18 centery. Canada is young country, but there are towns there much older, than it. Old indian settlements, towns, founded by indians themselfs... You can't say that Canada is 200 years old. It had another name, by it existed much later. There were only single tribes, but it changes nothing. Europeans came there not so long time ago... Damn, why am I telling you about it? You know it already without me.

Founded by the Emporer for a new capital, right?
Or was it a fort against the Finnish/ scandanavins? I dnot remeber my course on russian history very well any more.
Stalin messed up NEP- that makes him evil, along with the fact that he has killed the most people in human history.

[Megatron]

He killed the most people in history? Against hitler and the how he killed millions of jews, soldiers and himself? Or big boy explosing in hiroshima?

[James]

I'm waiting for the US to start bombing Northern Ireland. "Hey there's 'terrorists' in there somewhere so let's just bomb the whole fucking country!"

Nuke Belfast! Nice

And this would fit in nicely with the anti-taliban sentiment, since both the taliban and the PIRA were indirectly funded by the US.

Why not Spain too, after all the Spanish are harboring Basque sepratists so they could be in league with OBL.

Maybe the world would have been a better place if nuclear fission had been left undiscovered.

It's a pretty difficult issue to decide one way or the other, and with Joe's fanclub around this isn't the place to do it.

However, Niels Bohr said of it "we are in a totally new situation which cannot be resolved by war". And he was right, so far. Now, since '45 we have seen much bloodshed, but thankfully not on the scale of WW1 or 2. What with the situation in Europe in the late 40's and early '50s, it could be rationally concluded that the cold war really did keep the peace.

But the cold war was not without a large toll in lives, and we now pay the economic costs. Even in "western" countries this is a factor, and we are all affected by the destabilisation in the "east". And, we weren't far away from reducing the planet to the settings of our favorite RPG once or twice.

[James]

He killed the most people in history? Against hitler and the how he killed millions of jews, soldiers and himself? Or big boy explosing in hiroshima?

This is very difficult to quantify. Before the war, Stalin killed millions in his purges, and still more were sent into prison or forced labour.

Lets not forget the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact: Stalin and Hitler were equal partners in invading Poland. Or the Winter War.

Stalin treated the Ukrainians so badly that when Hitler broke the M-R pact and invaded the Soviet Union, many welcome the Germans as liberators.

How many of the deaths in the famine which followed the revolution are attributable to Stalin?

And, when Churchill mention "an iron curtain has descended across the Continent" he wasn't being melodramatic. The people in the Warsaw pact countries did not want to be a buffer zone for a tyrannical regime.


When we consider WW2 in the European theatre it's easy to attribute all the deaths to Hitler for starting the war. And this is true in many ways. But, even if you ignore the fact that the Stalin helped start it (see above), how many millions were killed by the genocidal treatment of German, Polish, Finnish, etc POW's by the Soviets? And by the Soviets treatment of their own troops: you should find out what happened to the Soviet POW's who, after escaping death from the Nazi's slave labour, camps and death marches, actually made it back to the USSR. Not nice. (especially when you consider that the UK and USA repatriated 1000s of Russians who were serving in various capacities for the Germans in France, knowing full well the fate that was in store for them at the hands of Beria’s NKVD.)


However, we should remember those who gave their lives to stop the Nazis. Of all people, those from the USSR did the most work and showed the greatest resilience and paid the highest price during the war.

And I also don't mean to belittle the horrors of the Nazis. Their crimes are incomparable.

[Constipated BladeRunner]

He killed the most people in history? Against hitler and the how he killed millions of jews, soldiers and himself? Or big boy explosing in hiroshima?

Hitler killed 6-20 million jews, and about 4 million soldiers.
Hiroshima killed 34,000
Nagasaki killed 35,000
Dresden killied 134,000
Stalin killied 30,000,000+
True, it is difficult to say and one might raise the point that many died in the immediate industrialization of russia with WW1, yet stalin is generally considerd to have killied the most, no?
Stalin, however, did not make candels out of the fat of Jews and gypsies.

[Megatron]

Ok, but who killed the most people in history, personally? The highest I've seen is something like 16 kills with some serial killer. Pushing a button to fire a nuke doesn't count, and you have to work together to fly a plane and I want to know who single handedly killed the most....

[Constipated BladeRunner]

Ok, but who killed the most people in history, personally? The highest I've seen is something like 16 kills with some serial killer. Pushing a button to fire a nuke doesn't count, and you have to work together to fly a plane and I want to know who single handedly killed the most....

A german pilot in WW2 killed 234 people on the Eastern front. That is the highest Ive ever heard.

[OnTheBounce]

A german pilot in WW2 killed 234 people on the Eastern front. That is the highest Ive ever heard.

Are you thinking of Erich Hartman? If you are, he had 352 confirmed "kills" and not 234. He's even listed in the Guiness Book of World Records. But the thing is that he a "kill" - better to use to British term "aerial victory", really - doesn't necessarily result in the death of the pilot.

There are snipers in WWII that had far higher totals, some ranging up over 400, but those tallies are hard to verify and they were often inflated for propaganda purposes.

Knowing Pyro, he probably wants people killed either w/bare hands or at extremely close range when he says "personally". Fuckin' perv...

OTB

[Constipated BladeRunner]

A german pilot in WW2 killed 234 people on the Eastern front. That is the highest Ive ever heard.

Are you thinking of Erich Hartman? If you are, he had 352 confirmed "kills" and not 234. He's even listed in the Guiness Book of World Records. But the thing is that he a "kill" - better to use to British term "aerial victory", really - doesn't necessarily result in the death of the pilot.

There are snipers in WWII that had far higher totals, some ranging up over 400, but those tallies are hard to verify and they were often inflated for propaganda purposes.

Knowing Pyro, he probably wants people killed either w/bare hands or at extremely close range when he says "personally". Fuckin' perv...

OTB

Yeah, Its been so long sense I played European Air War

[Jeff]

There are snipers in WWII that had far higher totals, some ranging up over 400, but those tallies are hard to verify and they were often inflated for propaganda purposes.

Simo Häyhä, a finnish sniper (using iron sight rifle), 505+ confirmed kills if I remember correctly. Died earlier this year.

[the guardian]

Stalin, however, did not make candels out of the fat of Jews and gypsies.

candles? you fucked up retard, more like SOAP, there's a rather huge diffrence between the 2

[Megatron]

So it's 3000 kills in a plane

About 505 with a rifle

Knowing Pyro, he probably wants people killed either w/bare hands or at extremely close range when he says "personally". Fuckin' perv...

OTB

Yeah

How many kills close combat/kills by a civilian?

[Follower]

Stalin, however, did not make candels out of the fat of Jews and gypsies.

candles? you fucked up retard, more like SOAP, there's a rather huge diffrence between the 2

Soap, hairs, teeth, skin for shoes and bags... you name it. Who knew that human had so much use? And now tell me how good capitalism is?! Fasists surely showed what did it mean to be bad boys. Their production was far more impressive than most of gulags.

Who killed most of the people? Oh, this question is easy enough, though not many know about it - chinese guys - Mao. This old moron didn't kill in labor camps, he didn't kill people by thousands... he simply took all food from the peasants and gave them his red book to read in return. Millions died from starvation. Nobody want to say it, but their victims could be more, than 50 millions... This is only rumours, bu facts are facts. How many people will survive harsh winter without food?

[Constipated BladeRunner]

Stalin, however, did not make candels out of the fat of Jews and gypsies.

candles? you fucked up retard, more like SOAP, there's a rather huge diffrence between the 2

They made both.

[Constipated BladeRunner]

Stalin, however, did not make candels out of the fat of Jews and gypsies.

candles? you fucked up retard, more like SOAP, there's a rather huge diffrence between the 2

Soap, hairs, teeth, skin for shoes and bags... you name it. Who knew that human had so much use? And now tell me how good capitalism is?! Fasists surely showed what did it mean to be bad boys. Their production was far more impressive than most of gulags.

Who killed most of the people? Oh, this question is easy enough, though not many know about it - chinese guys - Mao. This old moron didn't kill in labor camps, he didn't kill people by thousands... he simply took all food from the peasants and gave them his red book to read in return. Millions died from starvation. Nobody want to say it, but their victims could be more, than 50 millions... This is only rumours, bu facts are facts. How many people will survive harsh winter without food?

Rumors vs. the facts of the russian holocaust of stalin. Heh, trickey trickey.
Also, Iam not a capatilast- Iam a solcalist, thank you very much