What FO2 lacked and what F03 NEEDS!

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 7:50 pm

i know what you mean actually even if they had pratically no storyline in fallout 3 i would still get it as long as it has the same engine

Meths · Post by **Meths** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 8:09 pm

Well.. it's actually difficult to imagine retro style in 3d. Maybe it's not impossible, but very difficult - and i don't believe that Interplay could manage to do that. They don't have any experience in making 3d games.
As for the number of dimensions - the world moved on, and it's the best solution to most of technical problems.

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 8:11 pm

3d bad....

The Shrike · Post by **The Shrike** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 11:16 pm

Well.. it's actually difficult to imagine retro style in 3d. Maybe it's not impossible, but very difficult - and i don't believe that Interplay could manage to do that. They don't have any experience in making 3d games.
As for the number of dimensions - the world moved on, and it's the best solution to most of technical problems.

Uh excuse me but I think you mean to say that you moved on. Not every game in the imediate future will be 3D. There are games that will be 2D when made 2 years from now. Not to mention that BIS has know experience with making 3D games. I realy dont want to get started on a 2D Vs. 3D disscussion so I am going to stop.

I'm not going to argue with anybody so i've armed my post with a lots of explanation. My opinion is that the retro style is kinda addition not as important as for example a good storyline. I liked this specific style of the previous Fallouts as well, but it might be difficult to implement correctly in the next edition.

The retro style is essential to the Fallout universe. It is what a 50's sci-fi writer would imagine a nuclear war being like in 2077. Without it the game would not be a Fallout game. The Fallout universe needs the retro look. It all fits in with the 50's influence of the game. It was an era when they thought that radiaton would cause huge mutant animals just like deathclaws and radscorpions in fallout.

Meths · Post by **Meths** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 11:45 pm

Uh excuse me but I think you mean to say that you moved on. Not every game in the imediate future will be 3D. There are games that will be 2D when made 2 years from now.

It has no future anyway...

Not to mention that BIS has know experience with making 3D games. I realy dont want to get started on a 2D Vs. 3D disscussion so I am going to stop.

Not to mention that BIS won't probably make Fo3. You know, they've got a problem. A big one. Money. We'd better pray they sell this title to someone responsible.

but you're right - it's not the discussion about 3d vs 2d so lets STOP or change the topic.

The retro style is essential to the Fallout universe. It is what a 50's sci-fi writer would imagine a nuclear war being like in 2077. Without it the game would not be a Fallout game. The Fallout universe needs the retro look. It all fits in with the 50's influence of the game. It was an era when they thought that radiaton would cause huge mutant animals just like deathclaws and radscorpions in fallout

.

However it might be difficult even for BIS team - Fo2 was the best evidence. I'm afraid that another team will not be able to keep it correctly either.

The Shrike · Post by **The Shrike** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:05 am

However it might be difficult even for BIS team - Fo2 was the best evidence. I'm afraid that another team will not be able to keep it correctly either.

That is one of the reasons why I don't have high hopes For Fallout 3 being good.

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:13 am

i just had a terrible thought... what if they sold it to blizzard. That would definitly be the end

Dan · Post by **Dan** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:20 am

Som Guy wrote:i just had a terrible thought... what if they sold it to blizzard. That would definitly be the end

And why excactly did you decide they would sell it to blizzard?

Spazmo · Post by **Spazmo** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:32 am

And what's the matter with Blizzard? If BIS were to take as much time as Blizzard does to make sure their games are good and finished, we'd all be much happier with Fallout 2.

Meths · Post by **Meths** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:36 am

Spazmo wrote:And what's the matter with Blizzard? If BIS were to take as much time as Blizzard does to make sure their games are good and finished, we'd all be much happier with Fallout 2.

Yeach think about Diablo2 - no bugs, game was extremly stabile - technically very good game.

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:36 am

I never said the WOULD sell it to blizzard i was just saying that that would be scary. Also i think it would be bad because blizzard games are always way to straightforward

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:39 am

your being sarcastic right?

Meths · Post by **Meths** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:41 am

They would sell it to smbd that would pay the most. Who is the richest right now?

Saint_Proverbius · Post by **Saint_Proverbius** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 2:01 am

Blizzard makes simple games with a lot of polish on them. Diablo 2 is fairly straight forward when you think about it. It's really just nethack or gauntlet with a really, really good item/character interaction system. Simple concept, done extremely well.

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 2:09 am

yeah and the best part of fallout is its complexity

Meths · Post by **Meths** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 2:48 am

Som Guy wrote:yeah and the best part of fallout is its complexity

Agreed. However complexity=bugs, unstability and whatever's the worst BUT it gives playability instead.
So complexity and simplicity must be balanced properly - only then this game is about to be a good game.

Som Guy · Post by **Som Guy** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 3:54 am

Indeed you are correct and fallout met this balance. However arcanum was to complicated and suffered from major bugs and sllow running speed. However blizzard games are on the other side of this by having games that are too simple and thus get boring and even tedious quickly

Meths · Post by **Meths** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 4:04 am

However blizzard games are on the other side of this by having games that are too simple and thus get boring and even tedious quickly

Just walking around and killing everything that moves :twisted: .Turn the brain off and go ahead.

Saint_Proverbius · Post by **Saint_Proverbius** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 11:50 am

Meths wrote:Agreed. However complexity=bugs, unstability and whatever's the worst BUT it gives playability instead.
So complexity and simplicity must be balanced properly - only then this game is about to be a good game.

Complexity means more quality assurance, not nessecarily more bugs.

However, simplification can lead to bugs in an RPG. Don't believe me? Read this thread about IWD2:

http://feedback.blackisle.com/forums/sh ... perpage=15

If you attack a shopkeeper in IWD2, it breaks the game. The city locks down, you can't get out, and no further advancement is possible because the person who gives you the quests in IWD2 goes hostile as well.

Rosh · Post by **Rosh** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:36 pm

Saint_Proverbius wrote: However, simplification can lead to bugs in an RPG. Don't believe me? Read this thread about IWD2:

I'll have to correct you on this. That is not a bug, it's usually a marker of poor design if it's out of view from everyone else.

Of course, the ability to play anything evil in the Infinity Engine games is a COMPLETE joke. Aside from a few cosmetic and token things, there's really no other purpose for alignment.

With the exception of PS:T, that is. Then again, it's silly expecting anything remarkable from a few month knock-off game. The Inbred Engine being "balanced" is by far the best joke I've heard all year.

Plus, I see Orin' is still an idiot. Puuk does a wonderful explanation of why games are starting to suck ass. As are all the rest of the "ROLL-PLAYERS". Why the hell do you put something into a game if it can't be used? Some of these morons need to stop jerking off over eye-candy and try Arcanum for terms of role-playing a character.

Unfortunately that the crack-rats have been trained in ways that would make any psychologist envious and have a burning need to nail the spacebar.