Best Case: More realistic damage system. Piece by piece, not into pieces...
Acceptable: That you actually see/notice injuries.
Best Case: Realistic item wear/aging (weapons, ammo, items, drugs)
Acceptable: Finding the same shit, but in different condition.
Weapons explode, break down (fixable), ammo that are duds. Searching for good stuff will also be a part of the game (but not like hack'n slash games)...something like Space Rangers has with it's equipment/ships. Stuff breaks and you need to get a new one at least untill you find those trusthworthy ones (the ones you name Priscilla).
Another thing is that I would like see the use of different weapons being usefull. When in a fight there would be a reason to use a knife instead of a pistol/hammer etc. Making certain weapons more usefull through the whole game. So that there would be a point to gather good weapons of different category. Also making the skills more needed.
I'd also like to see that using a certain weapon all the time would raise the skill on that particular weapon (it won't jam that often, you know how to aim with it etc.) so that you wouldn't change the weapons the same instant when you get a slightly better weapon. The good old faithfull so to speak.
What do you want in FO3: Realistic expectations
What made fallout good, as far as I'm concerned, was not really the graphics, nor the combat. Most of all it was the setting, of course. The feeling you got when playing it. Nice graphics adds to it, but a well made text based game could theoretically replace the whole thing, imo. I don't quite understand the obsession about the isometric view and the turn based combat. It worked well in fallout, and I wouldn't mind if it was used in fallout 3, but by the same token, recreating fallout 1 and 2 in a well made 3d environment could probably work, too. It would require a lot of effort on behalf of the level designers, but not unrealistically much. Bethesda had some nice areas in morrowind.
Suppose fallout was originally a text based game. That is to say, it was text only, no graphics at all. Once you would get into it, your imagination would make all the graphics you'd need - when you read the dialogue you would hear the voices in your head, you would see the faces in front of you. Now, of course, fallout has some nice graphics. That gives you some atmosphere, but your mind gets to fill in less of the blanks. This means the art that's there has to be spot on, for everything to work. The same goes for if fallout was in 3d. The more detail you add, the less your imagination will be working. If the 3d environment is properly made, it can work, just as fallout worked with the engine it had.
Frankly, I think a fallout 3d could actually be quite good. There are technical problems, of course, such as the travelling bit mentioned before. The wasteland is big and mostly empty, that's part of the deal with it, so mapping everything (like in morrowind) is probably no good idea. To make that work, you'd need things like teleportation and/or making the wasteland a lot smaller. Nobody would like it if it literally took weeks to walk through the desert.
Combat could be a pisser too, if it was 3d. It wouldn't have to be, but it could easily. Isometric and turn based works, but just because that's true, that doesn't mean it's the only way. Bethesda just have to figure out a way to make it work in whatever graphical world they have in mind.
What's important to me is the story, the quests and the dialogue. The detail of it all. Screw any of that up, and fallout 3 won't work. If they can get a decent combat system, turn based or not, and if they manage to keep the fallout atmosphere in the graphics, that's all they really need.
So what do I want in FO3? Apart from more fallout (and with fallout I mean what you would get if you had fallout and fallout 2 as text based games), I would like to see more history, more side stories and things to engulf yourself in. Areas like the glow, that don't necessarily have anything to do with any quests, but are interesting to explore anyway. Reading holodisks and archives from a time long lost. More history. Only please don't screw it up - stick with canon.
Suppose fallout was originally a text based game. That is to say, it was text only, no graphics at all. Once you would get into it, your imagination would make all the graphics you'd need - when you read the dialogue you would hear the voices in your head, you would see the faces in front of you. Now, of course, fallout has some nice graphics. That gives you some atmosphere, but your mind gets to fill in less of the blanks. This means the art that's there has to be spot on, for everything to work. The same goes for if fallout was in 3d. The more detail you add, the less your imagination will be working. If the 3d environment is properly made, it can work, just as fallout worked with the engine it had.
Frankly, I think a fallout 3d could actually be quite good. There are technical problems, of course, such as the travelling bit mentioned before. The wasteland is big and mostly empty, that's part of the deal with it, so mapping everything (like in morrowind) is probably no good idea. To make that work, you'd need things like teleportation and/or making the wasteland a lot smaller. Nobody would like it if it literally took weeks to walk through the desert.
Combat could be a pisser too, if it was 3d. It wouldn't have to be, but it could easily. Isometric and turn based works, but just because that's true, that doesn't mean it's the only way. Bethesda just have to figure out a way to make it work in whatever graphical world they have in mind.
What's important to me is the story, the quests and the dialogue. The detail of it all. Screw any of that up, and fallout 3 won't work. If they can get a decent combat system, turn based or not, and if they manage to keep the fallout atmosphere in the graphics, that's all they really need.
So what do I want in FO3? Apart from more fallout (and with fallout I mean what you would get if you had fallout and fallout 2 as text based games), I would like to see more history, more side stories and things to engulf yourself in. Areas like the glow, that don't necessarily have anything to do with any quests, but are interesting to explore anyway. Reading holodisks and archives from a time long lost. More history. Only please don't screw it up - stick with canon.
HHHhhhhrrraaaaaaaaahhhhHHH
Ammo is quite easy to create when you have the casings. Still making factory quality ammo is another matter (sniper rifle ammo or automatic weapons etc). Plus live 200 year old ammo is really really sensitive. They aren't that much duds, as small explosives.
The good old faithfulls are faithfull, always. Faithfull doesn't mean the best weapon, but it means the one that is still better than your knife or hands. Still there is ALWAYS a place for melee and unarmed, and that's what I want to see in FO3
The good old faithfulls are faithfull, always. Faithfull doesn't mean the best weapon, but it means the one that is still better than your knife or hands. Still there is ALWAYS a place for melee and unarmed, and that's what I want to see in FO3
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."
Philip K. Dick (1928 - 1982), Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?
Philip K. Dick (1928 - 1982), Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?
Well, so long as this happens, I won't complain:
<img src="http://www.pbfcomics.com/archive/PBF202 ... lyptic.jpg">
<img src="http://www.pbfcomics.com/archive/PBF202 ... lyptic.jpg">
to the moon beth! wham-pow, right in the franchiser!
Here's the deal kiddoes and plant life, and you can fucking remove this from the list if it's too creamy for beth to choke down her money-accessible plot hole.
Ahem.
Best case: I WANT TO BE ABLE TO FUCKING TALK TO PEOPLE IN A FASHION THAT IS SEMI REMOTELY KINDA LIKE HOW I MIGHT TALK TO A FUCKING HUMAN (OR FUCKING OTHERWISE) I MET IN THE GOD DAMNED DESERT, OKAY YOU STUPID MOTHERFUCKERS?
Unacceptable: Oblivion.
You know what I'm talking about lovey dovey's. If you accidentally (or in the case of on purpose, you can choke to death you servile xbox gaming douchehammer) played Oblivion, you know why it's a resounding failure as a role playing game. The simple fact that no matter what you do, I mean, NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO, including butcher every single person the game will let you butcher, then making corpse piles out of everybody in every town, or arranging them into a swastica like a /b raid or whatever, nothing changes. Nothin! You just (obviously) can't converse with the people who are currently in the corpse swastica. Once I reloaded a pre-butcherin' time save and just wacked the count and countess (everyone in the palace, really) of one of beth's fucking stupid tiny auto-travel towns with the people who have the really well prerecorded talk-trees that always end the same way no matter what you say. So I mooch around, waiting for someone to like mention, "Hey, did you hear? Important guy got murdered"
Of course not. No, it's cool to make a game you call an rpg, but in reality it's a feed the mobile objects the only thing they can eat (apple) and become an assassin (who's quest line was done better in about every other game, by the way) because it's the only motherfucking thing they coded in besides graphics with enough refeletions to make an xbox turn over and beg.
BETH MAKES GAMES FOR FUCKING XBOX FOR A LIVING, NOT CRPGS. DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE WORDS THAT ARE COMING OUT OF MY MOUTH? OBLIVION IS HALO THAT TAKES LONGER TO PLAY, AND AT LEAST BUNGIE HAS THE BRASS TO CALL THEIR FPS YOU CAN HEAR NPCS SAY ONE LINERS IN A FUCKING FPS, NOT A GOD DAMNED ROLE PLAYING (gasp for breath) GAME. Whew.
no really, am a wrong? This can all be summed up in one statement. Beth fucked up their own child. TES:O, their brainchild. There's no fucking way they ain't dropping our baby on the weed floor and fingerpainting with it's blood. They're dropping it, and I'll tell you this right now... I'm going to fucking download beth's fallout, because there's no way I'm ever paying for a bethsoft product to come out since daggerfall.
Amen.
Ahem.
Best case: I WANT TO BE ABLE TO FUCKING TALK TO PEOPLE IN A FASHION THAT IS SEMI REMOTELY KINDA LIKE HOW I MIGHT TALK TO A FUCKING HUMAN (OR FUCKING OTHERWISE) I MET IN THE GOD DAMNED DESERT, OKAY YOU STUPID MOTHERFUCKERS?
Unacceptable: Oblivion.
You know what I'm talking about lovey dovey's. If you accidentally (or in the case of on purpose, you can choke to death you servile xbox gaming douchehammer) played Oblivion, you know why it's a resounding failure as a role playing game. The simple fact that no matter what you do, I mean, NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO, including butcher every single person the game will let you butcher, then making corpse piles out of everybody in every town, or arranging them into a swastica like a /b raid or whatever, nothing changes. Nothin! You just (obviously) can't converse with the people who are currently in the corpse swastica. Once I reloaded a pre-butcherin' time save and just wacked the count and countess (everyone in the palace, really) of one of beth's fucking stupid tiny auto-travel towns with the people who have the really well prerecorded talk-trees that always end the same way no matter what you say. So I mooch around, waiting for someone to like mention, "Hey, did you hear? Important guy got murdered"
Of course not. No, it's cool to make a game you call an rpg, but in reality it's a feed the mobile objects the only thing they can eat (apple) and become an assassin (who's quest line was done better in about every other game, by the way) because it's the only motherfucking thing they coded in besides graphics with enough refeletions to make an xbox turn over and beg.
BETH MAKES GAMES FOR FUCKING XBOX FOR A LIVING, NOT CRPGS. DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE WORDS THAT ARE COMING OUT OF MY MOUTH? OBLIVION IS HALO THAT TAKES LONGER TO PLAY, AND AT LEAST BUNGIE HAS THE BRASS TO CALL THEIR FPS YOU CAN HEAR NPCS SAY ONE LINERS IN A FUCKING FPS, NOT A GOD DAMNED ROLE PLAYING (gasp for breath) GAME. Whew.
no really, am a wrong? This can all be summed up in one statement. Beth fucked up their own child. TES:O, their brainchild. There's no fucking way they ain't dropping our baby on the weed floor and fingerpainting with it's blood. They're dropping it, and I'll tell you this right now... I'm going to fucking download beth's fallout, because there's no way I'm ever paying for a bethsoft product to come out since daggerfall.
Amen.
I think in Oblivion, they were trying to give you enough control over your character to determine for yourself the way that he spoke, rather than giving you three options with the same outcome. I don't think any sensible person played that game and thought that his character was walking around saying "Gray Fox" and "rumors" to passersby.
Anyway, that was the style of the game. One of the most important stylistic flares of Fallout, on the other hand, is the awesome bad attitude dialogue options. I sincerely doubt that will be left out of the game. If it is, you're right, that sucks.
Anyway, that was the style of the game. One of the most important stylistic flares of Fallout, on the other hand, is the awesome bad attitude dialogue options. I sincerely doubt that will be left out of the game. If it is, you're right, that sucks.
Also, genres are just helpful guidelines. I mean, I think Oblivion qualifies as an RPG because you make your own character and you have a record sheet with his abilities on it. But I mean, that's an RPG element. It definitely has FPS elements. It has 3D fighter elements. It even has some puzzle game elements. It doesn't fit neatly into any genre, which I would mark as a point in its favor.
I don't mean to just praise Oblivion. There are oceans of things about it that I don't like, but none of them are that it doesn't conform completely to whatever genre.
And you're absolutely right. It's retarded that nobody seems to react to big things like the death of a count. That sucks. But first, Oblivion is a huge game with a lot going on. It has all kinds of mechanics at work. Maybe its reach exceeded its grasp. I'll give you that. But a few years ago, there were no games (not even the "true RPGs") that would let you attack whoever you wanted. It's a gradual process, this progress toward more and more realistic games and intelligent AI.
I don't know. I play table-top games for that kind of experience. With these video games, you kind of have to meet them half-way. I think it's nice that we have the option to kill the count if we want to, but I play with the understanding that I am following a scripted plot line. That there are limitations to what can be accomplished at this point in time.
It sucks that in Super Mario Bros you can stay underwater forever on a swimming level, but if you fall into water on a surface level you die. Sure. But it's the kind of thing you laugh off and forget about. You hold out for Mario 64 where that problem is solved and there's a whole new set of problems to deal with.
Seriously though, if that's your main complaint with Oblivion, my honest advice would be to just give shit a few years to catch up with our imaginations. Until then, get into D&D or something.
I don't mean to just praise Oblivion. There are oceans of things about it that I don't like, but none of them are that it doesn't conform completely to whatever genre.
And you're absolutely right. It's retarded that nobody seems to react to big things like the death of a count. That sucks. But first, Oblivion is a huge game with a lot going on. It has all kinds of mechanics at work. Maybe its reach exceeded its grasp. I'll give you that. But a few years ago, there were no games (not even the "true RPGs") that would let you attack whoever you wanted. It's a gradual process, this progress toward more and more realistic games and intelligent AI.
I don't know. I play table-top games for that kind of experience. With these video games, you kind of have to meet them half-way. I think it's nice that we have the option to kill the count if we want to, but I play with the understanding that I am following a scripted plot line. That there are limitations to what can be accomplished at this point in time.
It sucks that in Super Mario Bros you can stay underwater forever on a swimming level, but if you fall into water on a surface level you die. Sure. But it's the kind of thing you laugh off and forget about. You hold out for Mario 64 where that problem is solved and there's a whole new set of problems to deal with.
Seriously though, if that's your main complaint with Oblivion, my honest advice would be to just give shit a few years to catch up with our imaginations. Until then, get into D&D or something.
Heh, I disagree. Oblivion wasn't guided by it's genre, it was a brutal attempt to lower the bar of all role playing games. By which I mean games where you can play a role, right? Making a character is NOT playing a role. I can make a character in gunbound. I can make a character in mario party.
But nah, yer right. Xbox games written for people who don't like to have to play roles are great. Halo sold really well and to be honest, gave you a lot more tidbits into the idea of the role you were playing "master chief" than the silly way oblivion crams everything in the universe into one set of trees.
There was NOT (I was sorry to find) a "lot" of things going on in Oblivion. I wasn't playing it for D&D, I play D&D for that. I was playing it for an immersive computer role playing game, which it was not. Though the barely scripted npc apple eating and events were amusing at first, they were more hollow in many ways than the float text in fo2. At least the float text changed based on what's happning, right? And for side quests, I'm absolutely sure that the towns in fallout and fallout 2 held more of those than oblivion too.
So what exactly is yer point, goaty? That it's okay to not finish a video game? I don't agree. Played Fallout? They actually scripted events for the entire game! Shit, the god damned monkey island games had more scripting than oblivion. Diablo proved that random doesn't replace art and you know it kiddo.
So here's the deal, I suggest you get on board with the "Please actually work on Fallout 3 to completion" boat. But then again, you seem pretty happy with BG:DA3D for Xbox360, so cheers babe.
Here's 2 a fallout 3 that you can enjoy utterly. And I can chop up and rail to get that sweet sweet fallout cancer.
But nah, yer right. Xbox games written for people who don't like to have to play roles are great. Halo sold really well and to be honest, gave you a lot more tidbits into the idea of the role you were playing "master chief" than the silly way oblivion crams everything in the universe into one set of trees.
There was NOT (I was sorry to find) a "lot" of things going on in Oblivion. I wasn't playing it for D&D, I play D&D for that. I was playing it for an immersive computer role playing game, which it was not. Though the barely scripted npc apple eating and events were amusing at first, they were more hollow in many ways than the float text in fo2. At least the float text changed based on what's happning, right? And for side quests, I'm absolutely sure that the towns in fallout and fallout 2 held more of those than oblivion too.
So what exactly is yer point, goaty? That it's okay to not finish a video game? I don't agree. Played Fallout? They actually scripted events for the entire game! Shit, the god damned monkey island games had more scripting than oblivion. Diablo proved that random doesn't replace art and you know it kiddo.
So here's the deal, I suggest you get on board with the "Please actually work on Fallout 3 to completion" boat. But then again, you seem pretty happy with BG:DA3D for Xbox360, so cheers babe.
Here's 2 a fallout 3 that you can enjoy utterly. And I can chop up and rail to get that sweet sweet fallout cancer.
doing redeye a favour here...
dun da dun..
lalal.
dun da dun..
lalal.
Redeye wrote:Why not whine now? Get a head start!LoneGunman wrote:Soil erosion, accurate rainfall, accurate growth patterns for crops and a new feature in the pipboy that will let you manage your post-apoc combines and related agricultural equipment with ease and bada-bing you get fallout inspired John Deere farmer game.VasikkA wrote:As long as it has soil erosion, the rest is more or less irrelevant.
Seriously, ive been waiting so fucking long for a fallout game that im getting desperate. I almost reached out for a copy of Fallout:Brotherhood of steel yesterday at the store but i just failed to convice myself it was worth the pain and the complete loss of money that it is.
I for one havent played oblivion, so i am not able to give my opin on if it is crap or not. Is fallout going to be a first/third person game like oblivion apparently is? Who the hell knows for sure?
I prepare myself to be flamed the hell out of this forum for saying this: but i have been waiting so goddamn long for fallout 3 (just like the rest of you of course) that im getting closer to worry about it ever being done, rather than worrying about it gonna be something that im not used to.
I agree, and i am still concerned about the fact that it is going to suck donkey turds for not capturing the same feel that FO:1 & 2 did so brilliantly. But right now i just want FO:3 in whatever form its gonna be.
Then im gonna bitch and moan + spam bethsoft inbox with rants and deaththreats.
1. It should be at least an "M" game.
2. You need to be able to kill everybody.
3. World/NPC AI must be dramatically enhanced over Oblivion.
a. People should notice corpses ala Thief, Commandos, etc.
b. Missing items should be discovered. Time dependent on how obvious
the theft is. Stealing display case contents from a lobby should
be detected by the next patrol, or when a guard turns around.
Documents from a safe may be detected missing days or weeks later.
Scripting all of this would be unfeasible in the extreme, so expanding
upon the Morrowind ownership system would be required, along with
other elements. Like assigning ownership type variables, importance
variables, etc. These variables would have scope and nesting so that
if designers/level builders place items in someone's room, all items
placed in that room are assigned that person's ownership variable.
(Unless otherwise specified.) Ownership type would include "mine",
"guard", "organization/government/shared property", etc.
Similar hierarchies of relationships could be used to assign zones
or spheres of interest. These zones and spheres could cover the
inclination to get involved in fights between strangers, inclination
to report witnessed crimes (with timers for delayed divulgence),
group loyalties, security guard jurisdictions, etc.
There could even be combinational interaction. If enough "sentiment"
is expressed in a particular direction, Groupthink could set in. This
could help simulate mob formation, panic, mass hysteria, etc.
Combine that with the information waypoint system to achieve the
game of "telephone".
And so on, and so forth.
c. No ESP. Some kind of "Information Waypoint" system with a mix
of fixed-event, random, and semi-random "switches" would have to
be implemented.
d. Dialogue/rumor mills should reflect changes. This means at least
semi-dynamic parsing.
4. If combat can't be TB it should be smooth.
5. Instead of standard difficulty slider, a complexity slider that pushes the game towards Sim. CS:S----->Flashpoint (Or D&D--->Aftermath)
a. Realistic injuries, drugs, poisons, radiation effects filtered through
the retro-futurism. Yes, you can be the rock-jawed tough guy and yes
there is still radiation around 160+ years after the war. It can still be
goofy.
But I want to see limping, arms in slings, vision impairment due to
eyepatch- even graphical warping of depth perception, carrying
of wounded comrades (stretcher, fireman's carry, leaning on each other,
etc.) , vomiting from radiation or even poison/disease, pain simulation.
Of couse, this would be only if you push the slider all the way over.
If I trap somebody's favorite chair with a grenade, then later that day
when they sit down there should be a boom and chunks. I mean this
for a random target, not some scripted thing.
If I left the area, things like this would have to be calculated and fed to
the rumor mill.
Also, I want to see the FO/FO/FOT death animations in full 3D.
Guts and limbs flying in a pink mist. Oh, yes!
Fuck it, I'm tired of typing now.
I really hope this thing isn't going to be written for 10 year olds.
There should be a mature understanding of psychology, sociology, anthropology, cultural studies, and political science.
ok, maybe I'm asking too much.
Fine, then I want to be an Ex-Enclave Trooper in the militaristic imperial NCR ending you get if you kill Tandi.St. Toxic wrote:This is "Realistic expectations", in "the Real World"; not "Pipedream fantasies", in the "Kingdom of Make-Believe".
(As if NCR wasn't that way already).
What the fuck did I just watch.
off topic? OMG YOU'VE BEEN CENSORED... yet you're still posting. MYSTARY!!!!
Duck and Cover: THE site for all your Fallout needs
Duck and Cover: THE site for all your Fallout needs
In a strange way HL2 references seem a bit appropriate here.
The Eastern European/Soviet Bloc architecture is alien-'50s...
Add lots of art deco and fins on the wrecked cars and replace the Combine shit with Buck Rogers/Doc Savage/etc.
The mutations/weaponized biots become ghouls, mantii, radscorps, etc.
Lots of junk and rust-textures.
"Rumors?"
"Richard Grey Fox?"
Midgets?
AI good enough to know that everybody, even animals have a self preservation instinct that functions best by avoiding conflict, instead
of every fucking thing in a 100-yard radius becoming part of a hostile hive mind bent on bringing you down with wave-attacks.
Someone dig up that thread with the Fallout case mods...
The Eastern European/Soviet Bloc architecture is alien-'50s...
Add lots of art deco and fins on the wrecked cars and replace the Combine shit with Buck Rogers/Doc Savage/etc.
The mutations/weaponized biots become ghouls, mantii, radscorps, etc.
Lots of junk and rust-textures.
"Rumors?"
"Richard Grey Fox?"
Midgets?
AI good enough to know that everybody, even animals have a self preservation instinct that functions best by avoiding conflict, instead
of every fucking thing in a 100-yard radius becoming part of a hostile hive mind bent on bringing you down with wave-attacks.
Someone dig up that thread with the Fallout case mods...
im new to the forum but I used to play fallout religously till this whole legal bullcrap went down.(since F2 came out)
I wouldnt mind seeing a fallout tactics style, i like having the option of switching real time and turn based , but if they make it anything like oblivion, ill be down with that.
My only real concern is a bad ass single player post apocolyptic feel with plenty of the fallout humor.
A multiplayer option would be good also, the fallout community was one of the best communities in gaming to play in during Tactics prime.
Its just been a long time and I hope they reward us for this bullshit waiting
I wouldnt mind seeing a fallout tactics style, i like having the option of switching real time and turn based , but if they make it anything like oblivion, ill be down with that.
My only real concern is a bad ass single player post apocolyptic feel with plenty of the fallout humor.
A multiplayer option would be good also, the fallout community was one of the best communities in gaming to play in during Tactics prime.
Its just been a long time and I hope they reward us for this bullshit waiting
-
Dogmeatlives
- Living Legend
- Posts: 3193
- Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:35 am
- Location: Junktown, Phil's doorstep
They should just take Kingdom Hearts and add guns and drugs and keep the disney characters. That would be awesome. Also if they added a a paperboy-like minigame. Now that would be a great game.
And somewhere in the game there should be a racetrack where you can play a round of Falloutkart. Imagine racing against Sulik and Tandi with Dogmeat on the back of your go-kart throwing plasma grenades at them. Now that's a game.
And somewhere in the game there should be a racetrack where you can play a round of Falloutkart. Imagine racing against Sulik and Tandi with Dogmeat on the back of your go-kart throwing plasma grenades at them. Now that's a game.
Wasteland Radio, with Charlie C.
