i'm being repressed!

Stainless · Post by **Stainless** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 1:09 am

Neon Dingo wrote:Well done, lad.

We also have a $1 coin over here. And guess what it's called. The dollar!

Strap · Post by **Strap** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 1:51 am

It's all about being forced to do things.
If I really wanted to, I would say the pledge without a fuss, but it being forced upon me doesn't make me want to say it.
And it doesn't make me want to burn a flag either, all I do when it is time to say the pledge, at the beginning of 6th hour, I just stand (because the teacher/principal says to.) and I just stand there.
I don't flip the flag off, curse under my breath, plug my ears or anything. I don't care if anyone around me says it.
The "Under god" thing is pretty... uh, not american in my mind, but I'm not gonna bitch about it.

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 4:23 am

What is patriotism? Is it the belief that your country is right, even when it's wrong?

Patriotism to me is doing what you can to help the country and the people who live in it, to defend her against all threats foreign and domestic. To stand up for her when people throw false or slanderous remarks. To understand and respect those who fought and died for her and the very freedoms we have today.

That to me is patriotism, saying the Pledge is an option and standing for the National Anthem is a sign of respect, those are my opinions.

Personally I wouldn't want to see a Marine hurt for burning the Army flag. It's just a piece of cloth

I just hate Marines.

It's not the saying it, it's the being forced to say it. And no I don't stand during the national anthem, nor do I cover my heart. But if someone tried to force me too, I'd be damned pissed off.

Standing, covering your heart, or saluting is a sign of respect.

OTB, time and time again you have proven yourself articulate and intelligent in contributing to the conversation. Well done, lad. I agree with everything you have said.

Yet he still says he was in the Army

POOPERSCOOPER · Post by **POOPERSCOOPER** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 5:46 am

I agree with hammer, it's a sign of respect to do it. You don't have to do it, even if the teacher says so, but it's such a simple thing that your causing more dRaMa if you don't do it, so you might as well.

Neon Dingo · Post by **Neon Dingo** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 8:46 am

http://www.esquilax.com/flag/amendmnt.mp3

porcu · Post by **porcu** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 11:16 am

forcing kids to pledge allegiance to the flag is inhuman

Nuclear Gandhi · Post by **Nuclear Gandhi** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 11:19 am

I agree with you, but for some reason I can't place you are getting increasingly annoying.

Sol Invictus · Post by **Sol Invictus** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 12:19 pm

Are we going to make them celebrate holidays if they don't want to? Will they have to bake apple pie, join the Boy Scouts, and buy an SUV too? It's not tradition that's important in the US, it's the rule of law and personal liberties. When you make tradition into law you lose sight of what actually matters.

Well said. It's those nasty fundamentals (traditions) that caused the entire Muslim society to degenerate into the shithole it now claims it isn't. The Ottoman Turks were pretty civilized, not to mention secular during the height of their power, but when some people lost sight of the great thing they had going and chose instead to become ultra-patriotic, they turned the traditional Muslim prayers (which were optional, considering many living under the Ottoman banner were not even Muslims) into dogmatic practice and fucked the entire civilization upside down. Bigotry arose and society got fucked in the process.

Don't let this happen again.

OnTheBounce · Post by **OnTheBounce** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 7:53 pm

Neon Dingo wrote:Well done, lad.

If you're wondering why some people are snickering about this, ND, it's because I'm not quite old enough to be your father, but pretty close.

TYVM for the boost, though.

Hammer wrote:I just hate Marines.

I'm not too fond of them -- generally speaking -- myself. My problem w/them is that they take esprit de corps to the point verging on religion. They talk shit about the Navy, but in fact they are just the Navy's cannon fodder. They talk shit about the Army, but they train at Army schools (e.g. airborne) since the Navy is too cheap to maintain schools for them. Still, I've met one or two that were fairly decent, and there is a USMC Lieutenant that wouldn't have made it through the Green to Gold program if I hadn't been tutoring his ass. He graduated w/a GPA of 2.0, but hey, I can only work w/the raw materials I have on hand...

Exitium wrote:...but when some people lost sight of the great thing they had going and chose instead to become ultra-patriotic...dogmatic practice...fucked the entire civilization upside down.

Sort of like what happened to the Chinese. Here was a nation that was building cast iron bridges in the 13th century, which wasn't accomplished in the West for the first time until the mid-18th century (1754, IIRC) and had probed as far away as the eastern coast of Africa with huge fleets of 300 junks that could have easily swept aside anything Europe could have mustered at the time (in the mid-15th century). Then a wave of conservatism spread over the Ming court and they recalled their fleets insisting on an ethnocentric view of the world. The world would be a much different place today had things not gone in that direction at that juncture.

OTB

Kashluk · Post by **Kashluk** » Sat Aug 16, 2003 10:45 pm

Yup. Chinese might rule the world and North-America could be a silly, little province of Mayas.

InvisibleMonkey · Post by **InvisibleMonkey** » Sun Aug 17, 2003 3:53 am

I only have to say the pledge once a week and half the time I don't even say it. The whole making you say the pledge law is completely unconstitutional (like a lot of laws), it goes against the first amendmant. If you think about it, it is like someone trying to force feed you the American Flag,